Deal 6: 365 days of training from the world’s best photographers
Unless you haven’t been on your computer at all in the last 24-48 hours, you have probably heard by now that Adobe announced an end to their Creative Suite of products and will now be moving to a subscription only based service. This news was not received well in the photography community on Monday as photographers flocked to social media sites to bash Adobe and voice their opinions. Here are some facts about Adobe’s new move…
Adobe Photoshop CS6 Extended used to cost $999. On average, Adobe seemed to be on an 18 (some odd) month product cycle between CS updates. This means that if you divide $999 by 18 months you come out with $55.50 per month.
Going forward (and this has been an option ever since the Creative Cloud became available) you’ll have the option of buying an annual subscription to Photoshop alone for $19.99/month or you can have access to the entire lineup of Adobe products (formerly known as the Creative Suite) for $49.99/month. And as a bonus, if you are a CS3/CS4/CS5/CS6 customer, you’ll get the entire suite of products for $29.99/month for the first year. Adobe used to have an option for if you just wanted to pay month to month without an ‘annual agreement’ but that seems to be gone now. I believe that was $29.99 a month. Now you have to make an annual agreement but it’s unclear at this point what that entails.
So let’s see if this is more expensive, less expensive or a wash. Well, as you’ve already read above, if you used to be a customer who upgraded with each update (ie: always upgraded from CS4 to CS5 to CS6) then you will save money now. You won’t have to shell out a fat stack of Benjamin’s any longer at your local software store. If you pay just the $19.99 a month on an annual agreement plan, you will pay $359.82 every 18 months. That’s a savings of $640.17 according to my calculator. Am I missing something? That’s a savings of 64%…
The entire creative suite (Photoshop, Dreamweaver, Illustrator, InDesign, After Effects, Premier Pro, Muse and more) used to cost $2599.99. Divide that by 18 months (again, 18 months is the average amount of time between previous versions of CS) and you get $144.44 a month. Compare that to the new $49.99 a month and you have a $94.45/month savings or (again) about 65% less.
Now, I was never much of a math wiz in school but I’m pretty sure I didn’t screw any of that up.
Did Adobe just decrease their pricing by 65%? It sure seems that way to me. At least if you’re going off an average 18-month product cycle. You do have to take into account that there will be no more Creative Suite. That means Adobe will no longer come out with NEW versions of Photoshop. There won’t be a CS7. They will only add features to Photoshop that will become available the next time you open up Photoshop.
What About Those Who Didn’t Buy Every New Version?
That’s a great point. At $19.99 a month, it would take 50 months to come out to $999.99 (the cost of the old Photoshop CS6 Extended version). That’s just over 4 years. That’s just under 3 18-month product cycles. Call it two. That means that for those who are still using Photoshop CS4 and haven’t updated to CS6; they are still paying the same amount in the long run but are now getting the advantage of having the latest version of the software, with effortless updates as well as access to Adobe’s new Behance community.
I’ll admit…when I heard about all this on Monday I was pissed. I even blogged about it. I’m the kind of guy who likes to save up for things I want and pay cash for them, rather than throw it on a credit card and make payments. I don’t have a car payment. I would never lease a car. So the idea of basically leasing Photoshop on a month-to-month basis doesn’t make me particularly happy. The issue for a lot of people is that the consumer, the customer, no longer has a choice. There are some people out there who just want to buy a product and not worry about their bank account getting drafted every month. It’s one thing to plan for automatic drafts like your gas or electricity, your cable or your car payment. It’s another when you start adding stuff like software programs. It’s just one more thing that could go through at just the wrong time and cause someone to overdraft their account. People like having a choice. With the new system you are giving up your right to actually OWN a product.
Some people are also worried that since Adobe will have reliable/consistent income now with subscriptions that they will lose their competitive edge. They used to have to wow us all with each CS update. New features, new tools, new interface. They had to make us WANT it so we would flock to their website and stores to buy the new programs. If they get us all to sign up for these plans where they already have us, will they stop trying so hard to impress us? Who knows? Will that open the door to some relevant competitors? Who knows? Time will tell.
To be perfectly honest, I’m completely on board with getting rid of the physical copies of Photoshop and all the other Adobe products. When I buy a program like onOne Software’s Perfect Photo Suite, I don’t get anything shipped to my house. I get a license code emailed to me that I plug in once the software is downloaded. Easy peasy. What I think Adobe should do is just make an option available to us where we can rent the software for a full year or even multiple years at a time. And give us a discount for paying in advance. That way it’s pretty much just like it was before. Those of us who prefer this method won’t feel like we are renting a software program. It will be the same as owning it except we won’t have a disk sitting in the bottom of our junk drawer. This, at least to me, sounds very reasonable.
So what do you all think? This has been a very hot topic for the past day or so and everybody has different views. Let me know in the comments below and be sure to follow me on Twitter where you can get in touch as well.
June 1, 2013 08:36 am
I live in Nicaragua and often work in areas where there is no internet connection. What will happen then? No photoshop for me?
June 1, 2013 07:59 am
Nope... even though I own a design firm, we will not be moving to the cloud.
May 24, 2013 07:45 am
Sally, a 'win win' situation is where two parties win. This is definitely a 'win lose' situation which might after 10 years turn into a 'lose win'. In the short run Adobe can enjoy higher profits and lockout competitors while costing all customers a lot more. They have tainted Adobe with a unethical practice greed similar to Apples battalion of lawyers suing anything that moves thus stemming innovation. This makes great profits for the current executives but in the long run hopefully other products will develop and Adobe will lose.
May 24, 2013 05:43 am
Although I am a serious hobbiest, I prefer having my disk version of CS6 and Lightroom 4 in my hands. Although i will upgrade to Lightroom 5 when it becomes available (should that be IF a hard disk version becomes available later this summer?).
Get lost Adobe !!
May 20, 2013 06:29 pm
Unethical or dishonest are perhaps strong words. Sharp Practice is one that come to my mind. Adobe will be able to 'wow' users in by offering them a cut price year and once they are users they will not want to go back to their previous versions and lose all the new features. Therefore they will be trapped into paying ad-infinitum. Adobe knows this, they are on a win, win situation. So possibly 50% of amateur single users might drop by the way-side together with a few semi-professionals like myself, but the big bucks come from professionals and larger organisations who employ and so buy multi licences. They cannot afford to look elsewhere and re-train their staff, so they will just write it off as another running expense and continue. They won't switch back because of the like of us. They can even ask what-ever they like in the future, just the the energy companies, and their customers will go on paying because once effectively, locked into that system, it will be hard and expensive, for such organisations to leave. As I say, 'Sharp Practice' and a 'Win Win' for Adobe.
May 20, 2013 04:12 am
My problem with this option is that you have to buy the entire lot of products. I am not a web developer, I do not even use most of Adobe other products. To be honest, the only products I actually use is Photoshop, and Acrobat. If they gave pricing discounts for those of us that just want the photography related products, I would have no problems. I do not care if I have a disc in my junk drawer either. I have always believed they were behind the times.
May 20, 2013 03:06 am
Sorry, I still don't see how they are being unethical. I don't know what implicit agreement you thought you had. If you purchased PS CS6 because you thought that Adobe had promised to create a CS7 that you would be able to upgrade to a a standalone version, that was your mistake, not anything Adobe ever promised you.
In fact, Adobe is continuing to insure that your new cameras will continue to work with older version of Photoshop by continuing work on the DNG convertor. Now, if they chose this time to cancel the DNG convertor, I would say that that might be considered a bit unfair as they have established a pattern of providing support for older customers. Had they dropped that all at once, then I might agree with you. But they didn't. You can still use the software you have paid for, and you still have a path to continue using if for the foreseeable future.
I repeat, what implicit agrement do you feel they aren't keeping their end of?
May 20, 2013 02:58 am
OK, I agree, dishonest it is not... but I do consider it to be unethical. After all ethics has nothing to do with being secretive or open.
Here is how Wikipedia defines ethics (I've edited it a bit): Ethics refers to the reflection upon moral actions. It is a branch of philosophy that involves systematizing, defending, and recommending concepts of right and wrong conduct. The term comes from the Greek word ethos, which means "character". Ethics studies the moral behaviour in humans, and how one should act.
It's all very well saying that Adobe has kept us informed of its intentions. It's all very well saying that the purpose of a business is to make money for its shareholders (and the rest is noise). It's all very well pointing out that there's nothing human about a business company. It's unethical because they're going back on an implicit agreement (I know - not worth the paper it's written on) it has with its customer base.
Too bad indeed! it's all very well calling them unethical because they're going to do as they please and I, and all the other ruffled users of Adobe products shall just have to live with that. Which we shall in our different ways.
May 20, 2013 12:08 am
I think the only thing "unethical" about it is that Adobe has such a hold on the professional photo editing market that there are no alternatives. If I dislike Windows I can go to a Mac. If I dislike iPhone I can go to an Android.
If I dislike Photoshop... I could go to what? Gimp? Yeah it works but is a pain in the a to use. There are others but one must give up a good deal to make the jump.
Adobe would never take this subscription route if it weren't for this.
May 19, 2013 11:46 pm
How is it unethical or dishonest? Are they making a secret of the fact that they are going into the software rental business? Are they required to sell software just because you want to buy it? I think it's a stupid and shortsighted move because they are alienating their current base of photographer customers, but it is neither unethical nor dishonest.
May 19, 2013 11:37 pm
It's not just about the money. The major problem is that after paying for Photoshop for say 10 years you have nothing to show for it - if you stop paying you're left with nothing, nothing at all. The very least is that someone who was paid for a product for say a year should be allowed to continue to use his current version of the program for ever more. Adobe is proposing a lease system with no buy option and that seems to me unethical, or, if you prefer, dishonest. That approach may be fine for professional photographers (I expect it is), it is not fine for most amateurs. Is this Adobe's way of saying that they want their products to be used by professionals only?
May 18, 2013 06:35 am
Besides the money my biggest concern with using the cloud is that I live in the country and have a very slow connection to the internet. I currently use a satellite connection. It can take over 2 hours to download a 250 mgb file. I wonder how long it will take me to download any part of CC.
May 18, 2013 02:30 am
I do not like Adobe's decision to pursue a subscription model but I can understand their need to up their ante for greed, which is after all a human trait. The model is a shareholder favorite to increase cashflow and to smooth out and regulate company income and therefore dividends. It is just good business practice.
I am amazed at the number of people here that do no research before commenting and asking questions about what if... where the question has been asked and answered many times, even here in this response list. It does not take a lot of time to read what has been said on this list.
What if... temporarily I cannot connect to the cloud to operate the program? The program does not operate "in the cloud". It is downloaded once over your internet connection, installed and run on your computer/s (2 installations allowed, not seats). Photoshop CS6 extended is about 2Gbytes so if after PS CC7 is stripped of extras and guff it would still be a substantial download on slower broadband, say ADSL1 (dialup? fergedaboudit). CC7 full suite, yikes... Those of you with fibre yay for you. Do the math.
What if... I use my laptop away from the internet, say on a trip? Apparently the program "phones home" about once a month to check if your activation is current, about the time of the next payment date. If it cannot connect apparently there is a grace period rumored to be another month or so. Surely you can go on line sometime during your trip. Else go to the annual model.
What if... I stop paying and my PSD files are locked out so that I cannot print them? You did save them locally as DNG/tiff/jpeg didn't you? It just means that PSD's can't be read, edited etc. I'll take a bet that it would be blink of the eye before someone writes a utility to print PSDs, and there are several programs that can read them already, if not print them.
James Brandon on 14 May placed a link to a petition (sign it now, yes). On that page there is a link to Microsoft's response. I read there about Microsoft's subscription model for Office 396? (can't remember the number exactly but you know the one) It costs US$99 a year apparently for the full suite, allows up to 5 (Five...) seats plus if you stop paying it still allows reading and printing of any file produced. Another thing, there are alternative Office suites including freebies available. Full Photoshop does not have real alternatives!!!
There are plenty of good image editors available, including Photoshop Elements ( a cut down almost crippled program that millions of "amateurs" love) and many freebies but none can approach Photoshop CS.. for versatility or sophistication. For example which other image program has channels access, calculations and apply image. Lightroom? No layers, blending, styles, proper local adjustments through channel masks etc. etc. I own and have used Ver.2 but I drifted away over the years to Photoshop CS.. platform.
As an aged pensioner in Australia I, like thousands of others, have struggled to justifiably afford the CS platform. Here we pay an unexplained premium of between 30%- 50% or more for software where the AU-US $ is mostly at parity. Retail Photoshop CS6 is about $1066 here and $699 in the US.
I am not a Professional/Commercial photographer nor an "amateur", I am a Dedicated Recreational Artist Photographer (DRAP) of 43yrs experience, interested in high quality images for exhibition and competition. I bought CS3 as a mature age student and upgraded through to CS6. The only part of CC7 that I might like is the new Re-Focus filter, which is not enough to justify going to the subscription model and I have no use for the rest of the suite. I guess CS6 will be my platform for quite a while.
BTW I follow the Guy Gowan method of image processing (www.guygown.com) which explains my interest in the aforementioned tools.
I own all misconceptions, misinformation, miscalculations, errors of judgement and just plain silliness
If you are here then thank you and cheers
May 18, 2013 02:02 am
I’m personally not that concerned by the Rental vs Buying thing. If the price is right, I assume that I would keep upgrading until I moved to a different piece of software anyhow.
I am more bothered by the massive inequity in what I used to pay and what they are asking me to pay now. I used to pay $200 every 18 months for the full PS product, or about $11 a month. Now I can pay $240 every year for a product that Adobe describes as having “Limited access to services”. I’m not sure exactly what that means, but I would imagine Adobe is going to keep expanding that limitation in order to get me to go to the full CC product for $600/year. I’ve looked on the Adobe website, and I can’t find anywhere that lists what the limitations are. Vagueness does not inspire confidence in me.
So, I used to pay about $11/month for a full product and now can I pay $20/month for a partial product or $50/month for the full product. That's a pretty big increase.
When you add to that the fact that Adobe now has no reason at all to get upgrades out quickly and every reason to push me to a higher price level, it looks to me like I am only looking at downsides.
May 18, 2013 01:52 am
You have to understand that Kelby and the gang have no choice in the matter. Originally he was against this subscription idea but eventually got in line like a good soldier.
No offense James but when Adobe comes out and tells us "the subscription model is what people asked for" I can tell you that no one I know asked for this. No one.
May 18, 2013 01:12 am
David - I'm guessing you didn't visit my website and read my original post? The link is up there in the article. I have no alliance with Adobe. They've never given me a penny and I pay for Lightroom and Photoshop just like you do.
I didn't sell out and I never would. I simply ran some numbers and it started to look like there were some good savings. I ran the numbers again and came to the same conclusion. I ran the numbers by a couple friends and they came to the same conclusion. Some how, and I'm kicking myself for this, I left out the upgrade pricing. Just a mistake and a brain fart on my part. Guess what? I'm human. I make mistakes and so do you.
If you want a program that can compete with Photoshop, at least on basis level with layers, blend modes, brushes, masks, etc, then take a look at onOne Software's Perfect Photo Suite. Perfect Layers does all of the basic things that Photoshop does. And I'm guessing with this Adobe move they are going to roll out a few upgrades.
And once again...here's a link to the petition if you'd like to sign it: http://www.change.org/petitions/adobe-systems-incorporated-eliminate-the-mandatory-creative-cloud-subscription-model#share
May 18, 2013 12:21 am
your just like all the rest kelby media, jame belts, fro knows etc. you have sold out to adobe! shame on you! your last input was about paying in full for an 18 month subscription claiming it would not feel like renting BS once the lease is up I cant opn my old files anymore! so yea that is still leasing! also how long before that 49.99 is 79.99 and then 129.99 per month! it wont stop it will only get worse! you want to make the readers on dps happy tell us a software we can move to that is NOT an adobe product that can do similar things and seems to be headed in a direction of a solid substitute to adobe products! together WE made adobe what it is and TOGETHER we can bring them DOWN!!! its when people like dps, kelby media, james belts, fro knows etc are turning scared and selling out that makes adobe WIN and get their way! SHAME ON YOU ALL!!!!
May 17, 2013 11:11 pm
I totally understand the not wanting to mess with your bank account being debited each month but since you are used to stacking up the money and buying the product, just open an account for that purpose, then they can debit that account each month and you can use it to stack up your money just like you did previously and not have to think about it!
May 17, 2013 08:54 pm
Not everyone has unlimited downloads - I live a rural area where the only service available is satellite. I can't see myself being a Adobe customer in the future - time to go learn a new product ! Shame, it was nice knowing you CS.
May 17, 2013 03:41 pm
I think the clever move on Adobe's part is offering existing owners of Photoshop a cheap year as that will draw a lot in but once they start using the new features they won't want to relinquish them so will be forced to keep paying up. It's like when they got people to try out LR beter versions, it wasn't so much about ironing out bugs as getting customers hooked on the improvements. As I said before, I'm going to stick with my CS6 until it becomes unusable and like Brian, start looking for alternatives or just switch to Elements if I can't. Better not to get trapped in the first place.
May 17, 2013 01:56 pm
Hey guys, give James Brandon, the author of this article a break! He is only expressing an opinion and mybe his maths are not perfect for all situations but that is no reason to beat him up.
Take your complaints to Adobe - if you donot subscribe and their cash flow drys up they will soon address the situation and go back to a sale model. Nothing hurts a business more than a dimishing cash flow situation.
It would be interesting to see how many people complaining here are using illegal/pirated copies - they are the ones that will really hurt and so they should.
May 17, 2013 11:48 am
I have been using the cloud suite for some time now and find it fantastic. I paid the discounted student price of $14.99p.m for the whole suite for a year. I would never have used the other programs otherwise. This works perfectly for me.
May 17, 2013 11:03 am
I've already started looking at alternatives as the cable company rings true with me. It started cheap and as more "value" was added, much I didn't care about, my cost crept northward. Now I'm looking to reduce my cable bill with some cool alternatives that better meet my needs. Next project is how do I find a graphics package that gives me many of the same capabilities at a fraction of the purchase price. I just love a challenge.
May 17, 2013 08:28 am
I confess that I have not read all the posts, so perhaps the answer s have been posted.
Question 1: Is the PS CS6 upgrade version still available?
Question 2: How many licenses does a subscription "rent"? Currently it can run on 2 computers.
Question 3: I am assuming the guts of the program lives on your machine and it just checks the "cloud" to see if the subscription is paid for. What happens when you are offline?
Why doesn't Adobe have a decent FAQ page to answer these sorts of questions? Are they so arrogant that they think their customer base will just mindlessly subscribe?
May 17, 2013 07:00 am
I am not happy with the change, I am not able to upgrade everytime a new version comes out and I am not willing to go on a monthly payment plan. I had Elements forever without upgrading until I could afford CS5 & lightroom, so I guess I will keep my copy forever until they come to their senses or another competitor comes out with something I like and is mine.
May 17, 2013 06:47 am
Anyone else here considering Aperture?
May 17, 2013 05:34 am
Reading through these posts I'm finding a large amount of mis-information. Scott Kelby explained the new cloud system very thoroughly in a recent episode of "The Grid" (go to youtube.com and search Scott kelby the grid to view) In this show he cleared up much of this. Points to be taken, the software is downloaded to your computer, where it runs cloud free, except about every 60-70 days it will go to the cloud to confirm your subscription. Next I read over and over again, above, how this was way too expensive for the hobbyist. Folks, Photoshop is professional level software. Now before everyone screams at me, no you don't have to be a professional to use it, but most if not all hobbyist only use a small fraction of the tools available in Photoshop. What they should be using, and it is also much less expensive is Photoshop Elements. Elements has over 80% of the functionality of the full blown Photoshop. Guess what, you can get an actual copy on Amazon for as little as $59.95. You get to keep it forever! The second option is Lightroom. Guess what again, Adobe is not making Lightroom a cloud only service. You can get Lightroom for less than $200.00. Between these two programs you will have nearly all of the functionality of Photoshop, plus much more.
May 17, 2013 04:05 am
Regarding Lightroom, Adobe has said that it will be a stand alone product (for now) but also said that people using LR in the cloud will have more features to use than those not using the cloud.
They also said that having an online version of PS and a stand alone version was too difficult for them. How long do you think they will continue doing that with LR?
May 17, 2013 03:20 am
This isn't "subscription"; it's "rent/lease".
Subscription = pay for a while, then keep what you paid for. For CC, that would mean "subscribe for a while, and when the subscription's up, you keep the functionality you paid for, but no more updates". Analogy: magazine subscriptions.
Rent/lease = pay for a while, and when you stop paying, you lose everything". Analogy: renting an apartment, leasing a car.
I'd actually go for a real subscription model, but not rent. This isn't even "rent-to-own". If you EVER need to stop paying, then all you have is a bunch of psd files that are of only very limited use.
Hopefully another application will fill my editing needs. I'm sure that creative pros will go along with this (or risk losing their "competitive advantage), but serious amateurs like me may just want to look elsewhere.
Adobe's use of the term "subscription" reminds me of a line from "The Princes Bride", when Fezzik tells Vizzini [about using the term 'impossible'] that "I don't think that word means what you think it does" (or something to that effect).
May 17, 2013 03:17 am
Cable TV is a good analogy since every month I pay the fee and get 1200 channels with nothing on. While getting software on-line is a great way to go, I also question all of this cloud stuff as another way for companies to look into what I am doing. Privacy issues aside, this becomes one more was to get into my disposable income which really already disposed of before I see it. I keep my present CS6 as well and use it until I no longer can use it.
May 16, 2013 11:05 pm
Yulia, Christine, from what I have understood so far, the software will probably check against a server database once in a while that you've been paying and hence can continue using. Most probably the checking will be at the same frequency as the payments.
May 16, 2013 10:46 am
I avoid fixed on-going commitments whenever practical. As a hobbyist, I will never, ever subscribe as Adobe wants me to. I am currently on CS5 and LR4 with no reason to upgrade. So Adobe is trying to make a cash cow of me. #%#^ you Adobe, which is what you are trying to do to me.
May 16, 2013 07:15 am
The difference is that if you have a hard copy of the software it will keep working even if you don't upgrade. Once you get on the 'cloud treadmill' you will have to keep paying ad-infinitum because as soon as you stop paying I suspect you will lose access to the software. So I shall stick with CS6 and let it get really out of date. Then make do with Elements or switch to Corel.
May 16, 2013 05:32 am
This is likely a stupid question, but I'm going to ask it since I have done no research on the Cloud-based software from Adobe.
My question is this: If we are "renting" the software and accessing it via the cloud does that mean to use the program we have to have Internet access (to get to the cloud)? This would seem to be the only way it would work, but I don't want to assume that internet access is required to access the program since I've done no research.
If this is the case it's a BIG drawback. I work for a small non-profit and bandwidth is always a concern. Work productivity will suffer if I have to be online to work in InDesign, PhotoShop, and Illustrator. I can only imagine how slow my work will be given our Internet situation and I guess I'm just out of luck if the Internet is down?!? Oy vey!
Thankfully I upgraded to CS6 in December. What does this mean for Acrobat products?!? Overall, I am not a fan.
May 16, 2013 04:22 am
I got my CS6 Extended edition through the education offer for £180. I think I like this price better than any others that have been mentioned. would adobe be giving an educational discount when they do the changes???
May 16, 2013 02:27 am
wel Honestly I didn't read all comments and don't know if someone already mentioned the same topic that i?m about to mention. What if you don't have an internet connection? I love to go places and shoot and edit in some lost location in the small cabin in the middle of the forest. and it was very easy to be disconnected from the world to get concentrated and more creative. So I guess I will have to use the older versions of the software?
May 16, 2013 02:05 am
I broke down earlier this year and went to the subscription. I was running CS5. Perfectly fine. But I teach and with the massive leap of CS6, all my tutorial videos were instantly out-of-date. The thing that capped it for me was the inclusion of LightRoom.
I'll be suggesting it to all my students. Hey! Adobe! Please contact me for my address so you can send me checks for referring your products! :~D
Colorado Mountain College
Breckenridge & Isaacson School of New Media
May 15, 2013 10:53 pm
I think the majority of people stating they won't upgrade to the subscription eventually will. I hate to admit it but the more people I talk to the more I get the impression that they will eventually give in.
I, on the other hand, can do what I need to using other CS6 Production and other software I own. My life and career do not depend on this like most people.
I'd prefer if Adobe gave both options. It is obvious the ONLY reason they are doing this is to stop the version skipping that many people do. This is basically what the CFO said to investors.
Anything else Adobe says such as "this is what people want" is bull. Welcome to the new 'normal'.
May 15, 2013 01:37 pm
I've never been able to afford the Adobe Master Collection, and piecing together the toolset I needed was also too expensive. With CC, I now have access to the entire toolset. I'm already used to downloaded software (see Apple), so that's a non-issue. As for a monthly charge, I'm used to that, too, for just about everything else. For now this works out very well for me. As a backup, however, I'm keeping my hard copy of CS4. And I'm using compatibility mode for all of my files.
May 15, 2013 06:13 am
I will never do the cloud thing!
I paid full price for adobe cs6 photoshop and i will use it until it breaks and search for an alternative product.
Hopefully this bad move on adobe's part at least not giving an option to buy or rent will open doors to competition that has been needed for a long time.
I have enough monthly bills as it is to worry about (car,mortgage,utilities,phone ,ext!) don't want to add monthly software bill to the list. You know what happens if you forget or don't pay up for a month, software gets turned off!
May 14, 2013 11:47 pm
Hey everyone! In case you're interested, here's a petition from change.org to get Adobe to reverse this subscription-only model.
If you want your voice heard, this is your chance. I already signed it :-)
12K sigs so far, about 3K needed.
May 13, 2013 12:46 pm
I think the hobbyist will really be the ones that are hurt by this. I couldn't justify this much of a monthly commitment for this software, as awesome as it is! And I don't think there really are many other competitor choices that offer the same quality of software to switch too.
May 13, 2013 12:39 pm
I am still using CS2 to do the minor work I do in PS... can't say that $20 a month sounds like a deal at all. :(
May 13, 2013 08:35 am
There are 3 major issues here
1) If you dont upgrade every major version (most smaller houses/offices and individual users dont) then this is FAR more expensive. So this is clearly a way for Adobe to increase profits, nothing more. They are not going to do something that will loose them 65% of their cash flow for fun.
2) Net Connectivity becomes an issue....unless you can buy seveal months in advance and the licensing is cached going on the road where there is no net could be next to impossibly with the new CS. This is less and less common but if I'm on a mobile connection and Adobe insists on an upgrade before I can use it (other software has done that to me) then I am basically screwed. Worse if I have no mobile connection and it wants to check licenses.... See the game industry for peoples reaction to this sort of situation, now take that from fun to "This is my living"
3) Format drift, sounds silly but if I have files in old formats Adobe will need to be VERY careful not to break files and layouts, force upgrades etc. In one office I worked in we had old version so we could verify that the layout and images hadn't changed because of minor variations in versions. Final Cut pro was a classic case where a minor point upgrade causes massive issues. Adobe has always been good on this front but now they have to be even more careful.
May 13, 2013 12:47 am
I really wonder what the objective for Adobe is here. They are offering their wares for seemingly cheaper prices when they cannot control how their customers get access to the cloud.
They will have to specify minimal network speeds for the cloud to be accessed for a start because if a customer signs up and then discovers that their network connection is NOT up to speed, will Adobe give a refund? Customers may also have to upgrade their internet plans in regards to their download & upload limits. It is one thing to upload compressed JPEG photos to a website but how much will one need to work on a large RAW format file via the internet? Most internet providers have a faster download speed than upload. The upgrade of internet provider service may negate the
If you are a globe trotting photographer working on a laptop then your business could take a serious hit because of this decision.
Does Adobe guarantee that they will not keep any records of copyrighted work used on their systems within the cloud?
Seriously,I think that Adobe are being totally arrogant toward their customer base with this decision and that in the long run they are cutting their own throats.
May 13, 2013 12:16 am
I agree with the bundled pre-pay option you suggest. I, too, do not need one more thing added to my monthly credit card that I'm going to inevitably forget to pay off!
May 12, 2013 11:11 pm
At least for the hobbyists, this might be as good a time as ever to jump ship to alternates. I for one have been using The GIMP, primarily 'cos there was no dough for an authentic version of PS. It's free, open source, and while not PS, it's not BS either. Does a pretty good job at image manipulation, even if it's missing the adjustment layers. Some pro's have been using it as well. Not to say there aren't others out there. There's Inkscape for those who can't use Illustrator, and so on and so forth. It's time we, the people, made a choice and a stand.
May 12, 2013 08:06 am
Something I hadn't thought about until I read one of the messages above. What incentive will Adobe have to improve the product? The company won't need to entice users to upgrade by offering new features. They can even take away features. Stop paying and the product doesn't work. That's the incentive.
May 12, 2013 03:29 am
I have decided to stop here and go a completely other way.
Microsoft have change there OS to complete crap and Mac is way to expensive. Adobe claiming the stairs to heaven
From now on will useLinux and open source software.
I would donate $100 to a team of volunteers once a while than see my money every month.
May 11, 2013 09:41 pm
Even if we forget for a moment, that the upgrade price is of course different than a new copy, you completely miss the point that customers do not OWN a physical copy anymore - WHICH THEY CAN SELL ON THE USED SOFTWARE MARKET TO ANYBODY AND GET PART OF THEIR ORIGINAL INVESTMENT BACK!
So to calculate the real cost of a software investment you have to subtract the resale value from your original price.
This together with the upgrade price issue and this whole article is a huge waste of internet space.
May 11, 2013 09:55 am
Please cancel my membership to DPS. They reprint idiots.
May 11, 2013 09:48 am
Alot of the outrage is based upon the fact that many of us have never understood that you do not and have never owned a copy of any software you have purchased. You are buying a a single use 'permission' to use token.
The software isn't yours now and never has been.
Now, with the monthly model, you are right. It kills the purpose of new versions and this kills the need to continue to improve their product. What this does do is open the door for a competitor to begin stealing Adobe's market share.
Overall this could, and likely will, end up being a very bad move for Adobe but it may intially seem like they made a good move due to the brand loyalty and feature set we have all become accostumed to.
May 11, 2013 07:32 am
The Crack Dealer Has Changed the Rules…
I’m furious about Adobe’s decision not to offer Photoshop as a boxed software and make it subscription only.
I am 72 years old and live on a fixed and declining income. I have been a loyal user of Photoshop since 1995 when I purchased my first computer. I faithfully bought every upgrade by saving my quarters and popping for the upgrade every 18 months.
I hope enough Photoshop users worldwide get pissed over their greedy decision. This is truly a sad day for amateur photographers. The Crack Dealer has just changed the rules.
May 11, 2013 04:26 am
Everyone seems to be concentrating on the cost but what about the fact that if you stop the monthly payments Photoshop will cease to work, you will no longer be able to open your PSDs.
Before you could choose to stay with on old version if you couldn't afford or didn't need an update and happily edit your images, now you are locked in to paying forever or for at least as long as you want to open your Photoshop files. That for me is the deal breaker, I'll be sticking with CS6 until a viable non-Adobe alternative becomes available.
May 11, 2013 04:16 am
Great, fantastic, for those in first world countries where most if not all have stable, continuous, speedy connections to the www. Just think for a minute how third world countries, and there are many going backwards not forwards, will manage this change over.
I live in S. Africa, which some might say is a first world country, well, not so. We only have one Telecommunications provider which is not the best by any means, as much of the country still cannot even have access to telephone lines as they are stolen as often as weekly (if replaced at all). For those who do have a "land line" ADSL is not available in all areas or at any reasonable speed or continuously if you live anywhere other than a major city. One area just 20 mins drive from us has had their lines stolen so many times that our one and only supplier has refused to replace them. They are now working purely by WiFi type connection where Down speeds of 100kbps and Up speeds of 40kbps are the norm. We can go mobile... ha ha ha, well sort of, again only really successful in major cities, friends living in outlying areas even struggle to connect let alone use mobile phones.
I administer a payroll (very small) via cloud computing and have been doing so for about 2 years now, I'm not in a major city but am only about 130km from the nearest. Each month I struggle to either connect, stay on line or complete the payroll successfully in a "reasonable" time frame. Photography is a passionate hobby for me but I do still have to edit photographs. How can I reasonably justify paying for something I would in all likelihood not have access to when I most need it? For those of us in this same situation - Is Adobe going to provide us with either a suitable connection to the www or a hard copy of the program?
May 11, 2013 03:56 am
Actually, Adobe should continue to come out with new versions like CS7, because they will always need to market their products to new potential users, so I think the author isn't accurate on this. I have been a Creative Cloud subscriber since last year and am very happy with the model. I was able to start freelancing from home without shelling out $2K+ for Creative Suite. So for $50 a month it's a deal. 1 hour of freelance work a month pays for it. Why are people whining? It's professional software, so if it's still too much for you use something else.
May 11, 2013 02:56 am
"One problem that I can see is if I need to replace my computer for some reason. Will I be able to reactivate my version of Photoshop?..."
Should be no problem as long as Adobe supports CS5 and runs the licensing servers for that version... they've taken the CS2 licensing servers offline only a few months ago, but CS2 users got a download link to a version of CS2 and a serial that doesn't need an extra activation... according to this experience you should be save... at least until the official support for CS5 ends.
May 11, 2013 02:26 am
What happens if one wants to work offline? Am I going to need a solid wi-fi connection just to work through my SD card? So much for remote/laptop access.
But, like others, I can't afford to update every cycle. And I can't afford this silly subscription plan either. I'll make do with older, stand-alone versions of PS etc.
And when that becomes a problem, well, I'll look at competitors. Maybe it's time to take another good look at GIMP. ;)
May 11, 2013 02:02 am
Users will resist moving to the cloud-based Adobe suite or even microsoft office 365. This will push users to move to open source software..
May 11, 2013 01:10 am
I am not quite sure about other countries, but at least in India, Photoshop is priced at Rs. 45,000, while Adobe is planning to charge Rs. 1,000 a month for a single product. Which I feel isn't a bad deal, especially since it lowers cost of entry for most enthusiasts and ensures that you get constant product updates.
May 11, 2013 01:08 am
I am in complete agreement with the majority of comments that I have read here. I have been upgrading every other version. I got the hard copy of CS5 two years ago and paid $205 for it. At the time, I thought that I would probably be going with CS7 in another year. That would make my monthly cost less than $6.
I am an avid photographer who happens to live on mainly social security. There is no way that I can afford the subscription price that Adobe will be charging for renting their software. I am perfectly happy with the features of CS5 and have no problem continuing to use it as long as possible.
One problem that I can see is if I need to replace my computer for some reason. Will I be able to reactivate my version of Photoshop?
What will happen when Adobe realizes that PS CC doesn't gain the acceptance that they were hoping for? Are they going to put Lightroom in the cloud and then Elements to try to get back the lost revenue?
Right now I can see plugin software developers scrambling to make sure that their products will be compatable to the other photo editing alternatives.
May 11, 2013 12:07 am
My wife is a photographer and I am a freelance video editor and we had to move to the cloud subscription a few months ago. Not only will we save money,a now have access to software we obviously couldn't afford which I believe skill help our business grow and stay competitive.
May 11, 2013 12:03 am
You can't blame the people for all the confusion about the Creative Cloud... Adobe and their information strategy generated this confusion at least to some degree... After Adobe announced the "CC Only" business model, I went to the Adobe website and all I found was a huge "list" of reasons why the cloud is good for me... somewhere it said that the software will phone home once in a 30 day period, to make sure that your licence is still valid. To get the entire picture I had to visit several Adobe pages and blogs, because the information was spread and the fact that some essential facts were posted several hours after the announcement did't make it easier... why do they pay their PR guys so much money? They should know that the first impression sticks in the peoples mind, even if you add some facts later and / or correct some misleading information later... many people won't even go back to the Adobe website some hours later, because the think they got all the information needed after the first time.
One of my concerns was that 30 day limit. At least once ore twice a year I travel for some documentary work (6-8 weeks, sometimes even more) to some parts of the world, where it's hard or impossible to get an internet connection... hours later, only by some kind of "accident", I got the information that depending on your payments (monthly or yearly) you can work offline up to 99 days and that it's just a phone call to the Adobe support to get a longer activation for travel anyway. This information alone, posted on the CC page at the time of the announcement, could have prevented some of the confusion about the cloud...
That said, I still don't like the "CC only" business model... and... as already mentioned in my comment above, I will not go for it. I don't want to "rent" a tool I use on a daily basis and I want to decide when to update. I want to have the choice... From all the "great new features" that came with the last few CS versions, only two have found their way into my workflow: The "Content Aware Fill" which is really great it you want to clean up a background (in non documentary work) and "Smart Objects" which add some great flexibility. In my book all the other updates since CS4 are "only" some nice gimmicks that I don't need. I also have no use for the updates that are announced for Photoshop CC... But... who knows... maybe in a year or so they will add some features I like or they might improve some of the tools I use... again, I want to have the choice to buy that new version, nothing more and nothing less.
That's just my - a photo and video guys - view on it... others e.g. a graphic designer may have some use for the other tools...
May 10, 2013 11:36 pm
As a user of PS and LR I am trying out the CS Cloud but ONLY because my husband needed the After Effects for his PC(I'm on a Mac). However after our year is up, I think we will just purchase what we need and just work with older versions, etc.
May 10, 2013 11:34 pm
I think it's great how much feedback this post is getting! There are a couple people getting angry with me for defending Adobe in all this. If you would click the link I included to my original blog post at my website, you'll see this isn't the case!
I was trying to approach the topic from an unbiased viewpoint to see how the cards fell and it seemed like we'd all be saving money in the long run. The one mistake I made was assuming that people upgrade at full price with each new release instead of paying upgrade pricing (duh). I'm going to run the numbers again here pretty soon and update the post to reflect that.
I think Adobe really needs to pay attention to this post and the comments therein. I tried to set some of all this negative feedback at ease with this post and it didn't work, not one bit! And I think that speaks volumes to the overall feelings of Adobe's customer base. You guys (and myself) are Adobe's income source. And I hope they will take the time to listen instead of making decisions regardless of our feelings/thoughts.
Keep it up folks!
May 10, 2013 10:03 pm
Now we've established (many times) that you don't need web access to work with the software...
I think it's a blindingly obvious step for a software company to take for a variety of reasons and Adobe aren't the first.
As with any company, the trick is to try to satisfy the needs of as broad a range of customers as possible, so their options and pricing structure (as with Cable and Mobile phone companies) will have to adapt and be as flexible as possible in future. If they succeed in that, they'll continue to lead the market. If they don't, they won't.
Personally I'd like to see the applications split down (why bother with both Lightroom and Elements?) so an even more basic one is available, with packages of tools available for purchase or rent to suit what you actually need or use. Tailoring your own suite, if you will.
May 10, 2013 09:53 pm
Another example of a bully taking the consumer for a ride.
I am at retirement age and have cut up the credit cards so this is a terminal approach to pissing off the clients.
Over and out for me when my CS5.1 is no longer up to the job and there is an alternative. I am already a Capture One Pro fan and those guys are always pushing the technology along nicely.
Bye bye Adobe.
May 10, 2013 09:33 pm
The clever kids in the world of software piracy will no doubt find a way around this. They always do! So all this inconvenience and hassle adobe are causing the majority of us who pay diligently for the use of their software is only going to bloat their own bank accounts, while making the use of the products a financial irritation for most users, especially hobbyists and home users who already live according to personal budgets.
Though my thoughts are; the pressures put on people to have to think about ensuring their monthly debit order is met and ensure their adobe products can "phone home" monthly, as opposed to paying the bill once off and forgetting about it, is going to push more "honest" users towards piracy, for the sake of the users convenience and in defiance to adobe's new level of arrogance!
Bad move Adobe!
May 10, 2013 06:30 pm
sounds like they hired a goggle or microsoft ad agency...first step screw the little guy.....thank god I got a free copy of the cs6 suite....
May 10, 2013 01:13 pm
I really don't like the idea of being forced to update/upgrade whether I want to or not - already had it happen with Office at work, and the result was hours of wasted work time trying to fix things that hadn't been broken until Microsoft decided backwards compatibility (to the immediately previous version of the software!) was no longer their thing.
I upgrade about every three years and I love my CS, but like others have said, 6 will be the LAST version of it that I buy if upgrading again means moving to CC.
May 10, 2013 12:49 pm
Adobe are protecting their future, that's all.
Take this out a few years. What happens when there are no new gizmo's, no new tools, no new effects. There are no exciting things to release in an update, those of us with our eyes open won't buy feature stuffed but benefit deprived upgrades, Adobe won't have an income. They need a way past that.
In the long term, Adobe will run out of new things you can make Photoshop (and the rest of CS) do - usefully. With a subscription service Adobe get paid - and they don't have to update the product.
May 10, 2013 12:40 pm
I upgraded to CS 5 from CS4 for a couple hundred bucks. I wasn't planning on going further as I haven't really learned CS5, yet. I saw no need to go further and now I really see no need to go further.
May 10, 2013 12:20 pm
:Well, one thing's for sure.. Hitler doesn't like it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=67Iw9q2X9cU
May 10, 2013 11:55 am
May 10, 2013 09:48 am
Yea, today's news made me literally sick to my stomach. This begins a major clusterf*** for me to try and get the group I'm in upgraded/converted/ASSIMILATED (because I do want the new software). Having to bring in the IT dept., who frowns on just about everything because of "security", and the legal dept, who reads all the EULAs with microscopic glasses, will slow this process down to a crawl. If I start tomorrow, we might see the new stuff by next year...if at all. I already know there will be cries of "find something else to use" because IT does not like clouds...
Does anyone know if we will HAVE to store files on the cloud, or will we still be able to store on our corporate network instead? Assuming we get past the setup/switch nightmare, this will be the 2nd nightmare.
May 10, 2013 08:21 am
Just remember, if you don't pay, then all the files marked '.psd' are just random bits taking up space.
You can't use your own data any longer if you don't pay Adobe for the right to open and print it.
Renting software is not what I do, I purchase a permanent license and continue to use it until I find the compelling need to upgrade. I usually upgrade every other version, saving myself some major money. Now your rental happens every month and if you don't pay, you get kicked out of the Adobe Arms and onto the street.
And if Adobe stops liking you, or finds your registration in some way deficient or invalid: They kick you out and lock your bits. Read the license: It all accrues to Adobe and nothing to you.
CS6 Ps will be the last thing I purchase from Adobe. And if, as I think, the PhotoshopUser community plays up the CC over the CS6 code, I'll drop that membership as well.
May 10, 2013 08:19 am
I am a photo hobbyist who has been a devoted Photoshop student for over 20 years. I have paid for every single upgrade. I frequently use layers, layer masks and other techniques that can't be entirely replaced by Lightroom and have no intention of giving up Photoshop. However, I will not move to the CC subscription version. I save many thousands of psd files from my raw files every year, and once I move to the CC version, I must be an active subscriber for the rest of my life if I want to later open and manipulate those files in the original application (or also save a tiff copy and find another application to view and manipulate them). As of now, CS6 will open every psd file I ever created. So I will stay with CS6 as long as it continues to work on the Mac OS. This subscription model may work for professional and organizations, but as a retired enthusiast, I am very discouraged.
May 10, 2013 08:14 am
I've never paid for a copy of photoshop in my life. Adobe seems to have finally answered the pirates with this move. We'll see how folks get around that.
May 10, 2013 07:33 am
My version of CS6 works with Windows 7 and Windows 8. Since MS will support both of those for the next decade or longer, I don't see any reason to upgrade CS6.
At this point, it will do 99.9% of what I need it to do (and I do most of my work in Lightroom anyway, so what then becomes 0.001% of what Photoshop won't do for me becomes totally irrelevant). Other than perhaps upgrading my copies of Lightroom as I have in the past - if there's a reason - Adobe has seen its last dollar from me until at least 2025+
May 10, 2013 07:13 am
As someone who lives in the boondocks, and for whom internet connectivity is difficult and very expensive, this utterly blows.
Never going to give up my (ancient) copy of Creative Suite!
May 10, 2013 07:07 am
Your calculation is wrong: it costs 1000 us$ to upgrade from CS5 to CS6; divided by your 18 months : 55us$ per months;
May 10, 2013 07:03 am
For me who upgrades every twenty-four months, the price doubled ($200/24 = $8.33/month for CS; $20/month for CC).
The software wants to call home every 90 days. What if you are out in the field for months and your computer has no internet connection? I know people who don't attach their computers to the internet for lots of reasons and this model will crush them.
Leasing means you have to pay every month, no matter how much or how little you use the product and when you stop paying, you loose access to your files. Granted you still loose access if Adobe goes out of business and you can't install the software on a new machine (or get your old virtual machine configuration running), but, this rubs me the wrong way.
Another way to look at it: Given the pricing structure, Adobe is encouraging bundling vs. ala carte. If you have the extreme situation of only using one Adobe product, (e.g., photoshop), you find the price went up significantly.
May 10, 2013 06:49 am
Wow, there are a lot of misconceptions in the comments. It's not a "cloud" product in the sense many of you are thinking. It installs and runs on your computer just like it always has. Once every month, it checks in with Adobe to make sure it hasn't been copied to more computers and to verify that you are still a subscriber. On several occasions, I've been on the road when it tried to authenticate and I just got a message saying that it needed to authenticate soon. I don't know how long the grace period actually is since I've always connected within a few days of getting the message, but I'd imagine it will give you a month or two before locking your apps. So.. As long as you can connect to the internet for a few seconds every two months or so, you shouldn't have anything to worry about.
In addition, you don't upload your photos anywhere or do any of your work "in the cloud." Your Adobe apps as well as all of your files stay on your computer, just as they always have. For the most part, Creative Cloud is just Creative Suite with better copy protection and at a much cheaper price than we used to pay. I'm assuming the point of this is that they are cutting down on piracy and then passing a portion of the recovered profits along to their legitimate, authorized customers. I've been using Creative Cloud since almost day one and it is honestly a win-win proposition for all involved, imo.
May 10, 2013 06:45 am
There are a couple fallacies in your logic. First, if you are a photoshop only user and update every couple years at a cost of $199 the cost per month the cost is $10 which is twice what the Creative Cloud will cost you. In addition, if you own a license, you can use it going forward but if you rent via the Cloud, it's vapor ware as soon as you stop paying for the service. While this may be a good economic option for business users, it seems to be a very negative move for avid amature/hobbiest photographers such as myself.
May 10, 2013 06:29 am
As a hobbiest not making any money I use Corel. I have thought of buying Adobe but could not justify the cost. Now a monthly bill? No way! What happens when Adobe wants to raise prices? If it were not for Internet I would ditch cable. They raise their prices all the time. If you could make a year by year subscription choice with a discount it might be tempting again. Might.....
May 10, 2013 06:00 am
At this moment it is time for GIMP. No fee and same functionality.
May 10, 2013 05:50 am
To those complaining about the time away from an internet connection problem...
To call this a Cloud Computing service is not correct. You still have a copy of the software installed on your computer. It just needs to authenticated online with Adobe at a regular interval (I think it's every 30 days). Microsoft has been doing this with their software for years. Adobe's mistake was using the term "Cloud", but it's really not cloud software.
Personally, I don't like this approach of "leasing" software rather than "owning" it, but for those that do, the software will be perfectly usable without a constant internet connection (as long as you connect every 30 days).
May 10, 2013 05:41 am
As mentioned by two others already:
What happens when you don't have an internet connection? Your business comes to a grinding hault because of no interent connection? That is insane.
I can take my laptop and external drive anywhere and continue to work offline. Even emails. Just store up what needs internet access until I get back to the office or am able to hookup again.
May 10, 2013 05:29 am
I agree with most of the commentators on here and I'm equally opposed to the plan to move Adobe products to the cloud only.
Where I stay broadband is generally slow and working online is woeful at the best of times.
I also agree that if other company's follow suit, soon you'll be paying hundreds of pounds/dollars a month for those programmes you need and this will cause many smaller businesses to go under.
Let's all stay with the versions we have and boycott companies who attempt this kind of strategy.
May 10, 2013 05:21 am
Anyone who has a student in the house can get Adobe products for much cheaper than the retail price. How is that going to change with a subscription?
May 10, 2013 05:17 am
My issue...I've been using the same version of photoshop for 4 (maybe 5) years now and had no intention of buying a new one since I don't need more capabilities than I have right now. This is no good for me!
May 10, 2013 05:04 am
Your maths is flawed. If you already own an Adobe product you only pay an upgrade price. Master suite upgrade is £450 or £25 / month over 18 months which means that Adobe have doubled their price. Also if I don't want to upgrade or can't afford to upgrade I still have a useable product. This will be gone on the new system. Probably time to purchase final cut studio for my media production and stick to CS6 for photoshop.
May 10, 2013 04:55 am
Is there any software in your mind that can do the things Photoshop can do? Any? … Not even close seconds exist.
SO. … To me, I am stuck at CS6. … Even lately the CS6 version of the CC suite has updates that were not filtered down to to the stand alone versions.
Those extra abilities are something that I want. …
Lets say that I go to CC for those abilities. … And suppose, for whatever reason, I cannot make a payment for rental. … The software ceases to function, even at the level I have paid up to.
Dead in the water, nonfunctional gigabytes of digital paperweights. Money thrown out the window by me, to a company that seems to search for chain bound guaranteed profits over courting a loyal customer base.
Today, Adobe makes me unhappy.
May 10, 2013 04:54 am
This is absolutely ridiculous! Adobe makes BANK off of their software and for those of us that would like just upgrading for the lesser price each time new versions come out. Personally, I HATE them for doing this, so i guess i'm stuck with cs6 when cs7 and lightroom 5 come out, because there's absolutely NO WAY I am paying a month to month subscription for adobe. just let us users buy the software for heaven's sake!
May 10, 2013 04:52 am
I agree with Karl up there! What about those hours we are away from an internet connection? Deadlines now come at the mercy of the "Cloud"? I'm thinking that Adobe is somehow assuming that the internet is invincible and will never go down. Well, it's not, and it will! I wholeheartedly that desktop application are still a necessity in this day and age, now matter how we look at it.
I don't usually complain about something unless I offer a potential solution, but , to me, it sounds like Adobe's ears are closed off to the consumer, and their needs, and more to the binding of their check book!
Bad move Adobe! Bad move!
May 10, 2013 04:52 am
Also, a LOT of people do not have unlimited internet bandwidth to download the software... You already have to get some gigs for Apple Mountain Lion, some more (1Go !!) for xcode, now provide some for Adobe softwares...
These companies are deporting the 'delivery' fees on us !!
May 10, 2013 04:49 am
Like you and many others I have to admit that I was also really pissed when I heard about it... Especially because I'm one of the guys who didn't go for every new version. I had a look at the new or improved features and if they didn't add something useful to my workflow I skipped a version. I also like to own the tools I use on a daily basis... Photoshop is one of them. Renting is fine for me if I use some expensive tools like e.g. a RED only a few times a year, buying one would be more than stupid. Later on I also did some math and I can assure you that you didn't screw up... I got the same results...
Anyhow... I had a look at the new features that will come with Photoshop CC... from my point of view some nice gimmicks but definitely no must have tools... "Camera Shake Reduction"... I already have some tools for that. One is called tripod, the second one is increasing the ISO (really no problem with all the newer cameras) to get some faster shutter speed and Nikon calls the third one VR...
Next thought: In my workflow I do everything I can in RAW... I only use Photoshop for skin retouching and some final local adjustments using adjustment layers and layer masks. In other words 80-90% of my post is done in Capture One, 10-20% in Photoshop.
Photoshop CS6 has every single tool I need to get my job done. It allows a flexible "non destructive" workflow. Why go to the cloud? I guess I can use my CS 6 for the next few years without any problems... no need to make a decision now. I'll save some money and who knows... maybe I'll go and buy me a nice new lens from that saved money...
May 10, 2013 04:46 am
Marco, you should learn more about this CC product. Your software is not in the cloud and you don't need to be connected every moment you use the software.
May 10, 2013 04:44 am
@marco, I just wanted to chime in on your question about security. The "Cloud" that they speak of only means that you download and activate software from the cloud. You still install like normal and run on your own hardware. See CC FAQ. It looks like they offer some kind of cloud storage service too, but I think you can use Photoshop in a regular "offline" mode just like before.
However, you will have to connect to the Adobe Cloud once a month to verify that you are still paying for the service. Once your license is verified, Adobe will enable your products to work for another month. You won't need a consistent connection to the net for your normal day to day activities in Photoshop.
Hopefully that clears that up.
** Note - I don't work for or represent adobe - I am just relaying the information I have read elsewhere **
May 10, 2013 04:44 am
Can anyone imagine if Microsoft Windows 7 had been subscription based. We'd all be forced to use Windows 8 when it upgraded whether we wanted to or not.
While everyone loves the alleged short term gains this is really a disaster in the longer run.
May 10, 2013 04:42 am
Jack, if you are already used to being behind a version or so, what's the big deal? You are already not using the latest tools, etc. Maybe between now and the time you usually wait to upgrade, you can be looking for alternatives?
May 10, 2013 04:41 am
Two points here :
- what will happen when you are in the wild (or at a client's office) without internet and want to unload a photo (lightroom), modify it (photoshop) and copy the result on a usb key ? Will all the applications still work offline ?
- I don't own photoshop. My dad's company does. Only one of us use it at the same time even if installed on two computers. We probably use photoshop 3 hours a week altogether... Maybe we are wrong and not ok with Abode licence, but that's how we do. How will this be managed in the cloud ?
May 10, 2013 04:39 am
I only use Photoshop, and I can see problems with your math and your data.
First of all, the updates to PS cost $300 each. So, on an 18 month update cycle, I will now pay $360, an increase of 20%.
Second of all, there was a 25 month time lapse between CS5 and CS6. In that time I paid $300 for the upgrade. Under the new system I would have paid $500. An increase of 60%.
Your numbers might be correct for people who use the whole suite, but the entire class of photo enthusiasts are about to see the PS upgrade costs go up by 20% (your math) to 60% (my math).
This is leaving aside the fact that I just upgraded to PS CS6 a year ago, so Adobe is asking me to start paying for a minor update after only a year.
May 10, 2013 04:32 am
Lightroom is not 'cloud free' in the sense that it IS part of the CC suite for $50/month WITH all the rest. Good deal, methinks.
May 10, 2013 04:31 am
As a hobbyist in photography, I bought CS6, knowing that it would be the last version published before the cloud took over. What is not addressed here by Adobe, is the hobbyist who uses Photoshop once a month, once a couple of months, or after that great trip they took. Would they be willing to pay for a subscription, knowing they won't be using it during off times, and paying for it? This model really isolates the Photoshop user who only practices their art on occasion, but still values the software for it's capabilities. Yes, I have been using Photoshop since the days of Photoshop 4, but have only bought a new version when if benefited me to "upgrade". It would make sense to also have a model that would allow you to "rent" the software on demand, maybe 3 - 4 time a year as really needed. This would make the software more affordable for the non-professional who doesn't need to use it every day, week, or month.
May 10, 2013 04:31 am
Your Math assumes we pay full price each time we upgrade, or did I miss something? Once you have the full price version upgrades for PS are about $200 each. Plus I relly don't care about all the other parts of CS. Never use them. You also have to keep paying the "protecton money" each month to be able to still use the app! For a business this model makes a lot of sense, but for the hobbiest, not so much. If adobe is so concerned with piracy you could go the OSX vs WIN route. Apple sells upgrades of OSX for around $30 with steep discounts for bundles! It just isn't worth the effort to pirLower the cost ate an os for that price. I have no problem with not getting a physical disk. In fact I got a new laptop and downloading CS6 and changing the llicence was pretty painless.
May 10, 2013 04:24 am
Your math is slightly off. If you look at the fine print on their website, the discounted pricing for CS owners is only for the first year, after that you pay the regular price like everyone else. So your costs per 18 months is off.
My adobe purchase plan was to buy every other version, provided there wasn't some game changing option added (usually there wasn't) so the new subscription plan is not something that I like. I'm planning on shopping around for a good price on CS6 and ride for as long as I can and then maybe consider subscriptions unless a non-adobe alternative comes along (I hope!)
May 10, 2013 04:21 am
As a photographer with little cash, the greediness of Adobe is on my mind this morning. Adobe's current version, CS6, is the final version of the creative suite that will be available for purchase, and the CS suite of software will not be updated again. Adobe is moving to Creative Cloud, CC, and a $50/month rental for everything from now, on. … No pay, no play.
Formerly, I have bought the older Creative Suites at discounts, after the latest-but-greatest upgrades. But, even using older versions, I have used them for years beyond the latest-but-greatest upgrades. … Eventually, I would scrape together the money and get a newer, almost recent, version, always being able to expand my abilities. … It cannot happen that way any longer.
I do not object to a company making money. I think the Adobe CS6 suite is worth the money because of all the work they put into it, and because of the enormous amount of work I can do with the tools they created for photographers. And furthermore, I think Adobe will always be on the cutting edge of development and improvement of the product. I will want to use those tools too.
I really object to the fact that if I ever upgrade to the cloud version in the future, And then cannot come up with the money for the next rental installment, I will not be able to continue with the software at all. I will be screwed blued and tattooed, up shits creek without a paddle.
I think that is an egregious tactic for a company to take with their customers.
We are talking about my work, and my passion. …
May 10, 2013 04:16 am
If Adobe does not want to sell me their software... someone else will.
I use Lightroom (for now :-) but in general I say "No" to software subscription model.
If Adobe moves Lightroom to the cloud... market will react and someone will fill the void.
I may need to learn how to use another software but it is no big deal.
Actually... I will think twice before I pay to upgrade my Lightroom (even if it comes as regular software)
May 10, 2013 04:10 am
I don't understand your numbers. No one buys a new copy for each upgrade. Photographers also don't need Photoshop Extended. Regular Photoshop is $699 or $625 at Amazon right now. The upgrade prices for Photoshop is $199. Photoshop CC is $20 per month. Lets look at the numbers
Photoshop CC 1Y$240 2Y$480 3Y$720 4Y$960 5Y$1200 6Y$1440 9Y$2160
Photoshop CS 0Y$700 1.5Y$900 3Y$1100 4.5Y$1300 6Y$1500 9Y$1900
If you don't have photoshop right now (must do) and you buy every upgrade (don't need). Photoshop CC gets more expensive after 6 years. Most people don't upgrade every time and don't need to. If you even upgrade every other version CC is more expensive after 4.5 years. Photoshop CC is more expensive in less than 3 years compared to Photoshop CS, if one does not upgrade. None of this includes those (most) who already have Photoshop. For those, CC is more expensive after the first year. And they get to keep their copy of Photoshop. After 3 years of CC and $720, Photoshop is gone if you don't keep paying. Long term Photoshop users are definitely paying more with CC. So, please explain how CC is cheaper for me, a Photoshop CS 6 owner?
You can't just look at the first year and you can't just look at those who don't have photoshop. It just makes you look like an Adobe shill. I am tired of all the bloggers using incorrect numbers when they talk about how great CC is.
May 10, 2013 04:02 am
One other thought about this. Is Adobe GUARANTEEING THE SECURITY AND RIGHTS OF YOUR PHOTOGRAPHY??? What is hidden in the fine print? I don't put my work online very often because it is too easy to steal and doing your editing online is a concern as to what copies are stored after you edit? What is open to hackers and what is Adobe doing to assure the best security of their servers??? I could envision a massive hack of their servers and a Chinese stock photo company starting up the next day!!!
May 10, 2013 03:59 am
You failed to mention one supremely important point. I'm not surprised that the initial price is a significant savings for most people. But look what happened with Cable TV. When it was first offered, it was cheap too. I seem to recall it was only about $10/month. Now that we're all addicted to it, they've upped the price to a minimum of about $40 or $50 with some people paying as much as $150! Watch your purse strings folks. Once they get in the door with SaaS (Software as a Service) they'll soon take over everything and you'll by paying through the nose!
May 10, 2013 03:58 am
Your math isn't really telling the whole story.
I need PS, Illustrator, InDesign, and Acrobat in my work. I generally skipped versions. The upgrade policy (before CS6) let me do this at "upgrade" pricing; which was roughly $550 for what I needed. $550 every 36 months works out to less than $16/mo. The Adobe products I use will now cost me 312% of what it used to.
That is a serious cost difference, and one I'm not sure I can sustain with the modest income of what is only a side business for me.
May 10, 2013 03:54 am
As a hobbyist, I have been using GIMP but recently have been considering moving to Adobe. This will stop that for sure. My only income is Social Security and I cannot afford these pricing models. And I too do a lot of work where there is no access to the internet, so unless it has an offline feature, it is useless to me. I do remote wildlife shooting. What about travel photographers who go worldwide? A large part of the world is still on wireless B or G. Will that be fast enough for such resource intensive programs? Somehow I get the feeling that Adobe JUST DOES NOT CARE ABOUT A BUNCH OF US and figures they can just screw us. Maybe I will look at what Paintshop Pro is doing these days. They were pretty good until I moved to GIMP. The biggest problem that I had with them was that as of version 8 it would erase the EXIF data.
May 10, 2013 03:49 am
"With the new system you are giving up your right to actually OWN a product."
In today's world, you never truly *own* a large-scale commercially licensed software product (whether Adobe's previous Creative Suite offerings, an operating system, an office suite, and so on). You're granted the usage of the software product until such time as the product publisher/developer deems you unfit as a consumer.
Open source developers (and interested parties!) of applications such as Gimp (vs Photoshop), Inkscape (vs Illustrator), Scribus (vs InDesign), Audacity (vs Soundbooth), Avidemux (vs Premiere), and others, should take note.
May 10, 2013 03:48 am
I am with you James. The comments seem reactive and not thoughtful. Of course when I found out CS6 wasn't available as an upgrade (which I do every couple of years) I was ticked. The I did the math. Now I get the use of Photoshop and Lightroom, plus every time an upgrade or new version is released I have it then, right now.
I say, well done Adobe. Keep up the good work and keep the Research and Development departments working late.
May 10, 2013 03:43 am
Upgrade pricing is missing. Also this might be a deal during the first 12-18 months IF you've never owned a copy of photoshop, but how is this a steal for all of us that have already paid through the nose to buy it? Essentially, a grand down the toilet. The math doesn't really account for that, either. This is the time for the competition to step up, there's never been a better time to capture the affections of the users of Ps than now.
May 10, 2013 03:33 am
I teach at a college and we usually tried to skip a version to save upgrade costs. Now the school is probably going to raise the budget needs for the Adobe software. In the end, who pays for it? The customers--the students. In this economy unless they give heavy educational institution discounts, I believe this will be a very bad move for Adobe.
May 10, 2013 03:28 am
I just use Lightroom, the CC doesn't interested me at all! It would be too expensive for my own hobby. I might go back to Bibble (Corel AfterShot Pro). Yes Lightroom is really good but if I cannot afford it it will go away. For those using Linux or Mac give a try to DarkTable, it's free and very powerful!
I think Adobe is going to be for real professional (like those having a business and making money out of it).
How about Photoshop Elements, are they going to stay as they are or go to CC as well?
For most of us hobbyist, Photoshop Elements isn't so bad.
May 10, 2013 03:25 am
I do understand that they want to curb piracy with this approach but as a hobbyist i think i might be a minority.
I use lightroom for my pictures and hopefully it will stay as independant in future but i am in the learning stages of photoshop and i plan to use photoshop for very few pictures as and when required.
With the future adobe plans, i cant afford to pay for annual subscription as i am not a pro and i cant even buy a month to month as that plan doesnt even exist.
May 10, 2013 03:21 am
Not to mention what happens when I decide to stop being a customer? Presumably I no longer have the ability to work with PSDs I have already created.
May 10, 2013 03:21 am
I don't know how this will effect Printers or Graphic Artists? They depend on Photoshop to manipulate images. Many CEO's will not pay a monthly fee. It seems to me that there will be a run on old hard copies of Photoshop. I know for myself I don't trust "clouds" and/or subscriptions.
May 10, 2013 03:18 am
What about working offline? Sometimes I'm away from civilization where the cloud can't be reached reliably.
May 10, 2013 03:14 am
Actually, version to version upgrades of photoshop cost $199, or about $11/ month. Creative suite had a similar but larger upgrade price. So yes, your math is flawed.
May 10, 2013 03:12 am
Every new release of Creative Suite had only one competitor to contend with: the previous version of Creative Suite. Now Adobe has eliminated that competitor once and for all.
People had a choice to "version skip" simply because the new features were not something he/she needed. Now that is no longer the case. You must pay for every change whether you need it or not. There is no choice in the matter.
As you pointed out, this is probably fine for shops that mindlessly upgrade for every version but for some of us this isn't good news.
What does one do when Adobe decided to remove a feature? It's been done before with some of the older versions of CS. How does one "protest" when one is locked into Adobe's subscription model?
The hubris of American software companies have no bounds it seems. Google can spy on you, Microsoft can toss out unusable Windows 8, Apple can jack you into their 'eco-system' for life, and now Adobe can make you lease their software forever.
Great times eh?
May 10, 2013 03:10 am
Your numbers work out for buying new, but what about for those on the upgrade path. Plus for hobbyists, once the subscription ends or you stop paying the monthly fee, you lose access to the program. I would rather pay a bit more and own it so when my world turns topsy-turvy and I have to cut finances then I own the software and can continue to use it.
May 10, 2013 03:06 am
I'm not at all in favor of someone charging my account every month, because, well, it's driven by a computer and we all know how computers can screw things up (I know people who work in accounting, the horror stories are pretty bad). I'm completely on-board with paying for a year in advance, especially if there is a discount.
May 10, 2013 03:05 am
You claim it's cheaper, but how many people upgrade every single one of the original titles every time there is an upgrade? Certainly not hobbyists. Your math doesn't include the upgrade pricing either.
All I see is a huge opportunity for other software providers to step up their game a bit and offer "No Subscription, keep what you pay for!" marketing.
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