Cropping for printing

[maxness]

Hi all,

So I've been working on getting proofs of some portraits I took. Whenever I get them back they have always had a tighter crop then when I sent them in. I had cropped to 8X10 thinking it would scale down normally which it obviously doesn't.

My question is, when do you crop an image before printing it? My assumption is that you have to do it after doing all of your color correction otherwise you'd have to repeat color correction and it probably wouldn't be the same. Also, is there a way to crop to 4X6 and have the same composition at 5X7 or 8X10? My guess is not since the aspect ratio changes but I'll ask people more experienced than myself.

Thanks in advance.

[dcclark]

Why would cropping have any effect on color correction? You're just removing pixels, not changing any colors. It's possible that an automatic color correction would work differently before vs. after cropping (since you might crop out a white or black area of the image), but otherwise... it doesn't matter.

I'm not sure what you mean by your prints getting a tighter crop. Who is your printer? Are they doing cropping for you? Are your sending them crops in a different aspect ratio than the prints you're asking for?

You're right about 4x6 vs. 5x7, 8x10, etc. -- the aspect ratios are different, so they will be different. Not HUGELY different, and you might be able to compose with multiple crops in mind, by leaving empty space on one side or the other.

On the other hand, 4x6, 6x9, 8x12, etc. will all have the same ratio, and thus the same crop will work for each.

[maxness]

I don't think I worded the post properly. I was wondering where in the workflow cropping should normally occur; obviously it would have to happen after color correction otherwise you'd have to repeat that process. Is there a standard workflow for when you are going to print images?

The last two times I've had proofs made I've had them printed at Walmart since I needed them the next day. Normally I'd get them from either Shutterfly or Miller's Lab. I had cropped them to 8X10 then had them printed at 4X6 so edges were cut off.

[dcclark]

Originally Posted by maxness

I don't think I worded the post properly. I was wondering where in the workflow cropping should normally occur; obviously it would have to happen after color correction otherwise you'd have to repeat that process. Is there a standard workflow for when you are going to print images?

The last two times I've had proofs made I've had them printed at Walmart since I needed them the next day. Normally I'd get them from either Shutterfly or Miller's Lab. I had cropped them to 8X10 then had them printed at 4X6 so edges were cut off.

Let me repeat what I said above: why would cropping affect color correction at all?

If you color-correct then crop, you'll just be deleting pixels and leaving others. The remaining pixels will still have the correct colors.

If you crop then color-correct, you'll be removing pixels and leaving ones, which then will have the right color.

There's no difference.

As far as printing -- yes, cropping to 8x10 and printing at 4x6 will guarantee that you'll lose something (or gain white edges, depending on what your printing service does). You need to crop to the ratio that you want to print at.

So, if you want to print at 4x6, crop to the 4x6 ratio.

[Walkere]

Originally Posted by maxness

I don't think I worded the post properly. I was wondering where in the workflow cropping should normally occur; obviously it would have to happen after color correction otherwise you'd have to repeat that process. Is there a standard workflow for when you are going to print images?

The last two times I've had proofs made I've had them printed at Walmart since I needed them the next day. Normally I'd get them from either Shutterfly or Miller's Lab. I had cropped them to 8X10 then had them printed at 4X6 so edges were cut off.

If you're working in Photoshop, then cropping should be the last step in your workflow. I read a suggestion on here a while back that you do all your work, save the original, and then make a copy that you can crop down to the right aspect ratio. That way you've got the original if you want to go back and re-crop to a different aspect ratio.

I do most of my work in Lightroom, which makes it easy to change these sorts of things, so I crop twice - once at the very beginning and then once at the end. I start by making a tighter crop at 4x6, then do any work to the picture. Then at the end, if I decide I want a 5x7 or 8x10 I re-crop the image before I export it.

- Brian

[b-honk]

Can I jump in and ask you how you crop it in Lightroom? I am having a hard time with the crop tool in LR, I wish there was something that would just give me a box indicating 8x10 and then I could "place" it where I want it on the image. Does that exist in LR or PS. I'm sure this sounds like an idiotic question, but I can't seem to get it.

[BCampbell]

Originally Posted by b-honk

Can I jump in and ask you how you crop it in Lightroom? I am having a hard time with the crop tool in LR, I wish there was something that would just give me a box indicating 8x10 and then I could "place" it where I want it on the image. Does that exist in LR or PS. I'm sure this sounds like an idiotic question, but I can't seem to get it.

I know this exists in GIMP.

When you are using the rectangle select tool, one of the tool options is "aspect ratio". There you can just set it to 10:8, 6:4, 7:5, 1:1, whatever. You then select, and GIMP will fix the ratio for you, you find your composition, and then choose "crop to selection".

I'd be very surprised if PS and LR didn't work similarly.

[moon]

In Photoshop, when you choose the crop tool you can enter the dimension for the crop at the top of the window along with resolution if you like.There is also a drop down menu with presets if I remmber correctly.