Group photos lighting-

[FlyingKiwiGirl]

A quick question. I'll be taking various size group photos outdoors(sun and shade), do you leave the omni bounce diffuser on the speedlite while bouncing the flash off a large disc reflector? If you do, is the reflector not diffusing some of the light anyway so it's like diffusing twice?

[zona5101]

Yes, essentially you are diffusing the light twice...but no concern in and of itself. The concern would be light loss because the light is spread out farther than the edges of the reflector. All that light is 100% lost. (Usually) better to keep the light within the surface to bounce from. Same concept as using an umbrella. You want to position the strobe to fill the umbrella with light and avoid having it back so far that some of the light misses the inside of the umbrella.

[FlyingKiwiGirl]

Great, thanks zona, completely understood! Nearly.

So, why do you have a reflector & a diffuser. What are the advantages/disadvantages of having both. As I have it; the reflector will direct the diffused light back on the subject and fill the off side(to the sun). Is the outcome the same as having the speedlite off camera and firing through my large disc diffuser(I don't have an umbrella but I do have an assistant)? And if this was the case would I take the omni bounce diffuser off the flash so I'm not diffusing twice again? I suppose that depends on how much fill light I'm wanting, right?

[ccting]

Originally Posted by FlyingKiwiGirl

Great, thanks zona, completely understood! Nearly.

So, why do you have a reflector & a diffuser. What are the advantages/disadvantages of having both. As I have it; the reflector will direct the diffused light back on the subject and fill the off side(to the sun). Is the outcome the same as having the speedlite off camera and firing through my large disc diffuser(I don't have an umbrella but I do have an assistant)? And if this was the case would I take the omni bounce diffuser off the flash so I'm not diffusing twice again? I suppose that depends on how much fill light I'm wanting, right?

I see some ppl use diffuser disk to diffuse the hard/harsh light that falls on subject. Reflector to fill light the shadow. Speedlight may not have sufficient GN to do that or may be more expensive. I believe reflector has better diffuse light than omni bounce diffuser..
I believe using reflector = big softbox. Using speedlight, you can see immediate effect,but using speedlight, you need to test with shooting first... so, how;s your wedding preparation?
LOL

Noob try to answer thing based on secondary info.

[zona5101]

Originally Posted by FlyingKiwiGirl

Great, thanks zona, completely understood! Nearly.

So, why do you have a reflector & a diffuser. What are the advantages/disadvantages of having both.

Different applications call for different tools. Some times one or the other will be the best choice.

As I have it; the reflector will direct the diffused light back on the subject and fill the off side(to the sun).

Yes. Now there is nothing "wrong" with the way you are doing it. You maybe just losing/wasting some light.

Is the outcome the same as having the speedlite off camera and firing through my large disc diffuser(I don't have an umbrella but I do have an assistant)?

Shoot through vs. bounced - there are some subtle differences in the light but the biggest difference is in the spread with bounced having more coverage.

And if this was the case would I take the omni bounce diffuser off the flash so I'm not diffusing twice again? I suppose that depends on how much fill light I'm wanting, right?

bingo. You cut down the efficiency of the light, making your flash work harder and increasing your recycle time.

Now if you had a really big reflector and you had to keep your flash in tight and you wanted a really large light source you might have to use a diffuser to get the light all the way to the edge of the reflector... a good example might be if you we're using a close wall for a reflector. You could really increase the apparent size of your light source by diffusing it before it hits the wall (at the cost of reduced light output).

[FlyingKiwiGirl]

Thank you ccting for your comments, I see you are also learning all about light at the moment, you are getting a good understanding. There is a lot of information to take in and, more importantly, remember. In theory you think you have a handle on it, then when you're out in the field under pressure it all flies out the window! Thank you for asking about the wedding, funnily enough I have no nerves. Yet. I feel that I've done as much as I can to learn and I've done a lot of practice so can only hope I can put it all into getting excellent shots on the day.

Thank you very much zona, your expertise is much appreciated, you have clarified a lot for me. I'm on my own now! Cheers.

[giannispass]

Is there any issues accordeing the distance from teh subject?
If the group is away, then i dont think that the bounce light is a solution

[FlyingKiwiGirl]

Originally Posted by giannispass

Is there any issues accordeing the distance from teh subject?
If the group is away, then i dont think that the bounce light is a solution

I think you would be correct with that unless of course you have an off camera speed light close to the subject and triggered remotely. I suppose the same would be said for a diffuser too......

[Doug Sundseth]

If your lights are relatively far from your group, you need either more light from the flashes or less ambient light and a fast lens. (This assumes that you want the flash as a key light rather than a fill light.)

Other effects: A distant light is a harder light, because the apparent size from the subject's position gets smaller as the light gets farther away. Distant lights will give more even lighting across a larger/deeper subject, because inverse-squared falloff is proportional to the relative distance of different subjects from the light source, and the relative distances are quite similar when lights are far away. With distant lights, you need to be a bit more careful about shadows cast by group members on other group members, because the lights are harder and because it's harder to get lights high enough to reach down between rows of subjects.

[zona5101]

Originally Posted by Doug Sundseth

If your lights are relatively far from your group, you need either more light from the flashes or less ambient light and a fast lens. (This assumes that you want the flash as a key light rather than a fill light.)

Other effects: A distant light is a harder light, because the apparent size from the subject's position gets smaller as the light gets farther away. Distant lights will give more even lighting across a larger/deeper subject, because inverse-squared falloff is proportional to the relative distance of different subjects from the light source, and the relative distances are quite similar when lights are far away. With distant lights, you need to be a bit more careful about shadows cast by group members on other group members, because the lights are harder and because it's harder to get lights high enough to reach down between rows of subjects.

excellent points to consider...