Filter Systems

[BunyipCatcher]

Hello All,

Ive been toying with getting a filter kit for creating landscapes in camera instead of with HDR and would like a bit of information please.

1) Iam looking at getting the Cokin Z-Pro filter holder so that it will allow me to go from DX to FX sometime in the future. There shouldnt be any problems with vignetting on wide angles right? Say with my DX 12-24mm at 12mm?

2) As Iam considering using Cokin filters to start with. Will this Z-Pro filter holder have no problems with better quality filters in the future. Say Lee or Singh Ray?

3) Can some explain to me how the Cokin graduated neutral density filter naming works please? Im looking to get 2 Stop Soft and Hard as well as 3 Stop Soft and Hard. Which Cokin model numbers would these be?

4) Has anyone gone from HDR to using filters and seen a major difference? Or even the other way around...Im interested in hearing your perspectives.

A lot of questions I know. I feel like to get the best quality starter system together you need a degree in Physics. Thankyou for any help you can provide.

Scott

[dcclark]

I'm not sure what going from DX to FX has to do with filters -- DX lenses (Nikon terminology) have the same front elements as FX lenses, and the same set of standard filter sizes (52mm, 77mm, etc.). If you go with standard screw-in filters, then a 77mm filter is a 77mm filter, no matter what kind of lens you put it on.

[navcom]

I agree with dcclark...don't know what you are worried about with DX versus FX.

I use a Cokin "P" style filter adapter and filters that fit. I've never had a vignetting problem with any of my lenses. I use Pentax lenses which have some of the larger diameters out there (64 to 77mm filter threads on standard lenses). I don't use Lee filters so I can't comment there. I use Singh Ray exclusively these days.

As for Cokin-brand grad filters, my personal opinion is to avoid them altogether except as practice filters. They will work but their quality is somewhat inferior. This is from experience.

On the HDR versus filter quality...it really depends on your use of HDR. My personal opinion is that most photographers use HDR way too much to the point where it's become another form of art versus an enhancement to traditional photography the way a ND grad filter is.

The best quality images you can get are what you get straight from your camera. The more post-processing you introduce, the more degredation can become an issue. While it is true that modern post-processing software such as Photoshop and Lightroom do incredible things (and I wouldn't be caught without them!), there is just something more natural from a filter image versus a software-enhanced image.

If you are trying to achieve a more natural appearance to your image, it's best to stay as close to the original light as possible. You only get this "on scene", not in the computer lab. A filter works by enhancing existing light while the picture is being exposed. An HDR program works by modifying pixels after the fact. By design, it can't change existing light, only modify what it has been given.

[BunyipCatcher]

Thanks for the reply Navcom. The reason Iam looking at the Z series filter system is that Iam worried about vignetting. I have read that with the P series you can go as wide as about 18mm (DX) to about 24mm (FX) with out any problems. But if I want to go wider then the P series is going to cause problems. As Iam considering moving to a FX body in the near future I dont want to have to buy two sets of filters. I want to get one setup and have it running well into the future.

My use of HDR up until now has been to merge different exposures to get as natural as looking output as possible (EG Flickr Photo Download: Rice Fields). I dont enjoy looking at overcooked HDR images. But sometimes the work involved in getting it right becomes a pain. The picture before took considerable time to get that small tree right with as little ghost as possible. I have never used graduated neutral density filters but think getting it right in camera at the start will give me better output.

When you say you are using the P series filter holder, how wide are you shooting? Are you using a polariser filter as well as graduated neutral density filters....or are you using just the wide angle version filter holder which I believe only lets you use one filter.

Thanks again for the help.

Scott

[navcom]

Originally Posted by BunyipCatcher

When you say you are using the P series filter holder, how wide are you shooting? Are you using a polariser filter as well as graduated neutral density filters....or are you using just the wide angle version filter holder which I believe only lets you use one filter.

Thanks again for the help.

Scott

The widest lens I use ND grads with is 16mm and I haven't had a problem. I do not use a polarizer along with the Cokin adapter. It may be a problem at 16mm, especially if it is a thicker polarizer. Also, you have to consider that when you start getting to focal lengths wider than around 12mm (I'm guessing here), you are probably not going to be able to use a filter anyhow as the field of view will be wider than any filter you use. As an example, many fish-eye lenses do not have filter threads at all because it's not possible to use them without obstructing the view.

I'm a Pentax user so I'm not that familiar with Nikon cameras, though I've had them in the past (just not as familiar with them). I also have not had an issue with film SLR's, which are full frame...but it's been awhile.

BTW, your HDR looks nice. It's very subtle and natural.

[dcclark]

There are some filters made specifically for wide-angle lenses -- they usually have very thin rims and are extra expensive!

Typically, it's not good to use a polarizer with an ultrawide anyhow, because things will be unevenly polarized throughout the image. Since polarizers are some of the thickest filters, that takes care of the vignetting problem neatly!

[BunyipCatcher]

Thanks Navcom,

Can anyone confirm how wide they have gone with a Cokin P-Series filter holder on a Nikon DX or FX camera body please using a the sprocketed drop in polariser and/or just the filter holder.

Scott

[AgBeard]

I use Cokin P with a Sigma 10-20 at 10mm - Cokin make a holder special for Ultra Wide Lens, it just has a single slot to hold only one filter & they recommend that any UV filter should be removed so that only the one filter is used. No vignetting problems.

Cokin P-Series BPW-700 Wide Angle Filter Holder

[BunyipCatcher]

Hi Agbeard.

Yes that is what I have heard. The P-Series filter holder for wide angle only lets you use one filter. That's not going to work for me. Because I would like to use a polariser as well as graduated neutral density filters. Thanks for the confirmation. Cheers

[dcclark]

Originally Posted by BunyipCatcher

Hi Agbeard.

Yes that is what I have heard. The P-Series filter holder for wide angle only lets you use one filter. That's not going to work for me. Because I would like to use a polariser as well as graduated neutral density filters. Thanks for the confirmation. Cheers

Out of curiosity, what are you planning on using a polarizer for with an ultrawide? (Especially if you want to stack filters together.) There may be better solutions.