My own infringment story

[Jim Poor]

Well, it happens to just about all of us eventually.

I was talking to a client who excitedly informed me that her friend (also a client) had submitted one of my photos to a contest and had been chosen as one of twenty winners out of 90,000+ entries.

Bells went off as I know that man of these contests are rights grabs and claim all rights to any photos entered, forever and ever amen!

Sure enough the contest claims all rights and doesn't give credit at all.

Now, I was faced with a choice.

Call the contest and have the photo pulled which would alienate the client and her tight circle of friends who are also good (really good) clients. This would also result in no credit for my work since my work would be pulled.

-or-

Make my point softly that she shouldn't have done it and let it go.

-or-

Let the contest publish the photo and then go after them.

-or-

Make my point softly, capture the web site announcing the winners, scan the printed material and then post something on my web-site as a "latest news" item in order to TAKE credit even if it wasn't given. The reason for the "latest news" item is that the contest holder's trademark and other copyrighted material would be use so I have to be able to claim editorial use to pass as "fair use."


At this point, the announcement has been made, but the printed materials haven't been produced. I've made my decision (unless something happens to change my mind), but am interested in hearing what your thoughts are.

Who is the contest held by? VA Lottery. You can see the winners here but I won't yet disclose which one belongs to me. Official Home of the Virginia Lottery

[Saralonde]

I'm thinking maybe your last choice.

Making your point softly is best, not only from a business standpoint, but because I really think this woman thought she as doing you a favor or felt she owned the photograph and doesn't understand.

I've never entered a contest, but wouldn't the rules have to state somewhere that only the photographer can enter? You'd think that would be in there just to protect the contest organizers.

Perhaps just using it as part of your advertising ("Contest Finalist") with the link would benefit you most.

[fletch]

Is it a dog contest or a photo contest?

Dog contest - I'd probably gently tell the client they shouldn't use your photos like that. Maybe tell the contest people they should have stricter guidelines and warnings about only posting photos people have the rights to. I'd just do it long enough after the contest to prevent my client being embarased but ensuring the company didn't retain the rights for my work.

Photo contest - I'd be harsher with my client and very very forcefull with the company running the contest, looking for financial compensation unless they could force liability onto my client.

[m.c.adams]

I think that I might say something to the person that submitted the photo, but I would definitly post a copy with the caption, "VA Lottery Contest Winner" and make sure everyone sees it. I say this, as I think it would be the calm thing to do, in reality, I would probably go to the person and throw a screaming fit, but thats just mu opinion.
Mark

[candleman]

i'd go after the person that submited it.

1. let them know they dont own the rights to the image, and gave something away that they dont own,
2. explain what the lottery comission might do to them... (Laywyers, damages)
3. explain what you could do to them (Lawyers, damages)

then you can tell them, in order to rectify the situation, they have to buy worldwide exclusive rights to the image. that way you AND the Lottery comission wont sue them.

thats what i'd consider doing. but i'd probably never go so far as to actually sue.. if they refuse to pay,
contact the Commission and say the picture beliongs to you.... and you want the "submitters" but kicked .. or else (insert logical threat here)

[waffles]

Why let it go? This might be a time when it's worth it to alienate clients a bit. People letting things like this go is part of why the industry as a whole is suffering.

I hope you go after her and the contest for letting her submit the photo.

[fletch]

Originally Posted by waffles

People letting things like this go is part of why the industry as a whole is suffering.

Thats a pretty big assumption to make. Any reasoning/evidence.

You could argue that because of the internet we are just more aware of this happening but it is no more or less prevavlent than it has always been. I definatley don't think that someone inocentlty entering a profesionally shot pet portrait into a dog contest is causing the downfall of an industry

[waffles]

Not the entering it in a contest specifically, but using the image in a way that they don't have the rights to use it in and the photographer knowing that but letting them get away with it for whatever reason.

[kleidascope]

I'd say go with your third option. Most people don't understand the whole who owns the rights and what can be done or not be done. I don't think she intended to insult or harm you in any way. She was proud of the photo and thought she was doing something good, something that would benefit you. She bought the picture and probably never gave it a second thought about submitting it for a contest, she had it in her hand and paid for it. I would advertise the heck out of it on my web page, without being crabby about it. Maybe kindly explain at another time in casual conversation how photo contests work and that you lost complete rights to the image.... but not much more than that. People don't understand it all

[candleman]

Originally Posted by kleidascope

I'd say go with your third option. Most people don't understand the whole who owns the rights and what can be done or not be done. I don't think she intended to insult or harm you in any way. She was proud of the photo and thought she was doing something good, something that would benefit you. She bought the picture and probably never gave it a second thought about submitting it for a contest, she had it in her hand and paid for it. I would advertise the heck out of it on my web page, without being crabby about it. Maybe kindly explain at another time in casual conversation how photo contests work and that you lost complete rights to the image.... but not much more than that. People don't understand it all

so..... i can give your car away then ?
if its a nice car i'll be doing a good thing.
its a win-win-win
1. I win because i look good and i win brownie points
2. somene gets a free car
3. you get to boast on your website about how someone gave your car away.

ignorance is no excuse.. they signed a contract, and the contract states they dont own it
"photographer retains ....."

at least in my contracts anyway


dont take this too seriously

i'm kindof kidding, but i dont think it should be left to slide.