How to talk shop without inviting critiques?

[sk66]

I would not want to get into "who's better", but i do not see why "going digital" earlier would translate into "naturaly has more work coming her way".
If she has more customers it's either due to marketing or results (word of mouth etc). It makes sense then that her "bright and washed out" pictures must be working for her and at least some customers/potential customers just as your "way too dark" work for you and your customers. Who's seeing it "right" is irrelevant, there is no "right" it's just opinion. I do believe there is "right" when it comes to monitor calibration etc, but that will ALWAYS be an issue with computers..even between different but correctly calibrated monitors...
You're happy with your results, she's happy with hers, leave it at that.
If you want to bring up monitor calibration, I'd simply suggest you say something to the effect of "I was considering what you said about my pictures being too dark, so I recalibrated my monitor and rechecked some of my pictures, but I really don't see any problems.....How do you calibrate your monitor?" It says "I value your opinion, I took it seriously, I disagree with your critique, and maybe the problem is with your calibration" without actually saying any of that.
If you don't want to talk shop, simply say "I really don't want to talk shop right now". If you don't want to be critiqued then either avoid the topic, be direct and say "I don't like it when you critique my work", or always just say something like "well they look good on my monitor" and dismiss the topic.

My favorite thing to do if the person is being critical of me or my work, is to ask their opinion on a certain subject.

It involves them, they feel like they are being helpful, you've asked for their input and it gives them what they want... attention.

I then go and try what they suggested and next time i see them, I tell them i tried it and tell them that it either worked or it didn't work and i tell them why.

This gets them critically thinking of their own process and why it didn't work. You've listened to them, used their knowledge and politely said that it didn't work or that it did.

But, what do I know... It's not like I deal in relationships all day

[blejavac]

I hate them ppl who shove their "abilities" in my face..like I have this great gear, I have those clients, I work for those ppl and that kinda crap..unfortunately the majority of "layman" dig that sort of crap and those loudmouths really get more work and more money = better gear (though its questionable if they know how to use it - ). anyhoo - the problem is in me, lol - cant get myself to be full of crap (as much - lmao). I have been in so many situations where my tech knowledge is far better than theirs, my knowledge of using software exceeds their abilities of even using the computer - and even when this gets proven in front of abovementioned layman nothing changes. so - its not really them, its me.. and for ur crappy "talk shop" evening - next time dont talk about it, turn to ur other table neighbour and talk about - dunno - diapers (there is enough crap in that - lol). oh, and stop calling her "friend" - acquaintance would be more appropriate
L

[sybren]

A friend of mine shoots Nikon, I shoot Canon. We're always teasing each other about it, about how the other brand is always doing things wrong. On the other hand, we also tell each other what the other brand has that we miss in our brand - I for example am pretty envious of the 200mm zoom on the new SB900. Somehow this mixture feels pleasantly fresh and light, and allows us to look at both sides of the equation.

I think it's quite impolite that she bluntly state your pictures are too dark and hers are good. Instead of trying to dodge the subject because she's rather harsh, you could turn it around and get a comparison of styles. If you print some of your photos, and let her print some of hers, you can discuss them over a nice glass of wine somewhere sunny. That gets the whole monitor calibration thing out of the way. If she says "hey, your photos look a lot darker on my monitor", you can always discuss calibration then.

Be sure to find positive things to say about her style. Keep the atmosphere bright and easy going (hence the sunny location). Perhaps by talking about your different styles, she'll be able to learn that there simply are different ways to make a photo.

I wouldn't say "my clients are happy with my shots", because that simply continues her way of discussion. If she says your shots are too dark, ask her what she means, why she thinks that. If you keep trying to get a proper reasoning out of her, perhaps it'll dawn on her that she doesn't have a real reason to say your shots are "wrong". Or perhaps she does have a very good reason - if so, you could tell her that you're glad she told you. That keeps the tone light and friendly. If she's only a bit sensitive, she'll remember it and come up with a more built up argument instead of just bashing your photos.

About having better gear: some folks make awesome shots with just a shoe box with a hole in it. Maybe you can remind her about that ;-)

[SusanAshlea]

Well, thanks for the responses-I appreciate it.

I ended up having some test shots of mine printed and I was happy with them. In the past, she has actually taken portraits of me and I was extremely happy with them, so I know that she has a keen eye. I just get irritated when she starts in about how I am wasting my time editing pictures, and wasting money on my gear.The best is when she tells me I am wasting time shooting in full manual, because auto chooses the best settings for you and "you can always fix it later". Lately I am finding her work pretty sloppy-and I know well enough not to critique her photos even when she asks for it. When she asks for a critique what she wants is for me to say "oh they are great, I love them!" So, I don't even go there with her. She keeps asking me to post more pictures online so she can see them and I personally don't want to for that very reason. When she talks about her work she is like "naturally, my clients absolutely loved the photos", etc...and I just get sick of hearing her toot her own horn while telling me what I need to do to improve. THEN she said she was double booked for a date in the spring and would just hire me for an hourly fee to do the even she didn't want to do. I lied and said I was booked that day.

*sigh* oh well. I worry that the fact that we both go into photography is going to end with us not being friends anymore. And, here I go again with them venting.

[SJH Foto]

You know, it really is difficult to say anything. I think that it would probably be best to agree not to get involved on that subject. Tell her this, and if you are both doing well, explain that since there is plenty of work for all, why don't we do something else instead. Does she bowl? There's a bonding sport! Or, shopping (I forgot you were icky girls...)

Seriously, do something you both enjoy and mutually agree to keep the shop talk taboo.

[DaShell]

It's always difficult to stay level headed when you feel attacked by your friends. I seem to always know what to say AFTER it's all over (or when it is someone else)

Next time she brings up your style as being inferior to hers I would just happily say "I'm so glad our styles are so different because that means we don't have to compete for clients! We can remain supportive friends than can relate to one another on a professional level. We truly have the best of both worlds."

She may or may not take the hint, but at least your not sinking to her level. You don't have to justify yourself to her and you certainly don't have to accept her opinion of you either.

[windrider86]

everyone has thier own unique style and does what works best, for them. You may want to point that out.
I would have said about the sock thing that I was hoping to go for a more professional work. lol just to be a booger
I have friends like that, the one uppers as I like to call them. Some of which do this when they dont even realize it. For those who are close to me, I hold up one finger and they instantly know what i am talking about and quit.

[neilwood]

Originally Posted by DaShell

It's always difficult to stay level headed when you feel attacked by your friends. I seem to always know what to say AFTER it's all over (or when it is someone else)

Next time she brings up your style as being inferior to hers I would just happily say "I'm so glad our styles are so different because that means we don't have to compete for clients! We can remain supportive friends than can relate to one another on a professional level. We truly have the best of both worlds."

She may or may not take the hint, but at least your not sinking to her level. You don't have to justify yourself to her and you certainly don't have to accept her opinion of you either.

I would say thats quite a good route to go down - hopefully she will get the hint.

She does sound very insecure (and also sounds as if she has very limited knowledge of the subject).

Shooting Auto?? How does she manage DOF? or doesnt she bother?

Originally Posted by neilwood

Shooting Auto?? How does she manage DOF? or doesnt she bother?

My exact thought, does she even know any of the other functions?