Misbehaved kids...any thoughts?

[valleygirl]

Thanks guys. I must say I am so glad I asked all of you because I've been feeling like a total failure these past couple of days. I can't say exactly why. I feel like maybe I should have been more forceful and told them to come back another time if they couldn't cooperate, or told them to brush the kids hair, etc. I wish now I had not offered to re-do the pics, because you all are right. That's just me feeling insecure I guess.

Funny thing is, there were several decent pictures in there which, while not perfect (the messy hair, etc.) are certainly good enough to use for an Xmas card. But she doesn't like how her hair looks.

You know what should have tipped me off? When she got here she said she went to another photographer last year and had called her to do the pics again this year but the photographer never called her back. Hmmm...now I think I know why.

[valleygirl]

Originally Posted by lputman

I agree, she should pay for another session if needed. If not, then chalk this one up to experience and keep on trucking. You know, along with us and many others, that you're a fantastic photographer.

Thank you. I appreciate that. :-)

[valleygirl]

With respect to this family's privacy, I loaded some of the photos into a private gallery. PM me if you want to see them and I'll give you the password. I'd love some opinions.

[PRH]

Its terrible trying to deal with unruly kids. I should know I have one (she's good most of the time but there are times when there is nothing I can do but sit back and watch the carnage)....anyway I would never expect someone else to do my parenting for me.
Its sounds like the mum took her whole family kicking and screaming to the shoot so she only has herself to blame for the result.
I hope you have better luck with the next family

[mahree]

Before I bought my camera and when I used to take my kids to Sears, the receptionist reminded me when I scheduled to make sure my children were fed, well rested, and have already used the bathroom....when they were babies that their diapers were changed...and stressed that they had a few toys to entertain the children but if they were "uncooperative" we would have to reschedule.

As for tricks: Our eye doctor uses a television to draw the attention of her young patients then says in an excited voice "WOW". When the patient looks at her she shines her flash light in their eyes. Maybe you can do something similar. Play a video full of funny stuff so they're always laughing then say something like "Look at this!" and then snap the picture when they look over.

....Maybe the kids were getting hot under all the lights. A fan might help.

[chickentaste]

A few things that've worked for me in the past..

i) Play a 'let's pretend' game with the kids.. "on 5, I want you to pretend that/make a face like you..". Give them plenty of chances to 'get it all out of their system', e.g. pretend that they're going down on a rollercoaster, they've just seen a ghost, etc. Throw in a few that need for them to look nice and respectable, e.g. you've just won an Oscar, you've just got a gold medal. Adn all the while you're doing this keep shooting. Chances are you'll get something nice either between faces or when you trick them into smiling nicely. Oh, and don't forget to warn the parents about what you're doing and get them to give you their best face as much as they can.

ii) Get out from behind the tripod if you're. If you can talk to the kids without them feeling like they have a moment to ruin you can often get something better than if you're busy concentrating with the camera at your face. This is very tough to do, but if you can maintain a banter with the kids while you're snapping away with your remote shutter release you can sometimes get something good.

iii) (with apologies to the neighbours) tell the kids you want to take some phtos of them shouting, the loudest kid gets to choose a candy. Thing is, they have to sit quiet and look innocent until you say go (show them this by sitting and smiling at the camera and then suddenly breaking into a guttural scream!). Snap away throughout. you might even want to give the kids a mini-'screaming' personal photo if they come out alright.

I really don't like giving kids candy as a reward for good behaviour, I know many of you probably think this is weird! IMO if you can try and make the picture taking process fun you don't need to give out candy.

I'd definitely have a long chat with the parents before taking any photos, ask them in a polite way if their kids are 'energetic', if they've done this kind of thing before, are they good at sitting still for long periods of time, etc. Warn the parents that sometimes things go wrong on the day and if they have any suggestions about how to keep their kids happy if they lose their patience. I basically like to try and involve parents early on.

Hope some of this helps...

[RSG1050]

I spend my summers teaching karate to kids, and I can concur with all those above who stated that the parents are to blame. I've wasted more time with "ADHD" under-10s than I care to think about, when 99.9% of those cases come down to parents not wanting to take responsibility and rein them in. I was expected in 45 minutes, twice a week, to make up for what they weren't doing the other 166.5 hours of the week.

Anyway, speaking from that, I'll repeat what others have said; it's no fault of your own. In cases like this, offering to reschedule is a good courtesy, and helps your word-of-mouth reputation, but you also have to think of your own sanity, and whether or not the time spent is truly worth it.

[JerBear]

Actually, it is very simple. When you set up your appointments, get a credit card and charge for the sitting fee right then and there. Let them know of your policy for last minute cancellations. If children are to be present during the shoot, you should let them know your policy on behavioral problems that can occur.

Give them pointers on how to have the best success with their children. For young kids, maybe a nap before they come and/or a promise of an adventure, where they are going to the toy store after, etc. For older children, let the kids know days ahead of time and how important the photos will be for the family now and especially in the future for memories to pass on. That they will need to be on their best behavior.

When a client does not give notice, I charge. Of course I will listen to the excuse and there are liberal exceptions were I will reduce or waive the fee (transfer the fee to a new appointment date within a specified time). But, if it is client that was raised with little or no manners, then I charge. Not worried about keeping that kind of client anyway, more trouble than they are worth and besides, my best work is with clients I like.

When clients bring in young children that are unruly, I will try to work the problems out with toys, stuffed animals, etc. But, if that does not work, then I will work with the parents to set up another appointment and discount the next sitting fee.

When the clients bring in older children that should know better, I am less understanding and usually will leave it in the hands of the parents to take care of the problem or they will have to come back. I will charge the sitting fee again and that usually gets the parents to act responsibly. Again, if they can not control their older kids, then that is usually the type of client I do not wish to work with.

So, to put it into a nutshell, parents should have control of their kids, if they don’t, then leave them at home.

Society has become very liberal with the way parents bring up their children. I believe that those children are not served well, that etiquette should be taught from the beginning of development and all through school.

JM

[Mystique]

Originally Posted by laurenfitz

I am not sure how to handle this, but the last few customers I've had come for portraits have had extremely poorly behaved children. This is to the point that almost all of the family pictures I took have the kids either sticking out their tongue, hitting each other, pulling hair or making raspberries at the camera. I try my best with my little tricks but these kids have just been downright uncooperative. The parents get frustrated and can't seem to control what is going on. Today the father couldn't take it anymore and practically got up and left before we were done.

So my question is, how much of this is my responsibility to try and control? Not being my children, I feel there is only so much I can do. I tell them I've blocked off two hours and that we can take our time, but they always want to take the pictures and run and then expect me to get something good with the kids are misbehaved.

Ugh. So frustrated.

I would take a very clear stand on this. First of all the parents can not blame you for how the pictures turn out when their children are not behaving. Second they are not getting their money back. Third if the children are in your studio they have to behave according to your rules. You should tell those children and the parents that you will absolutely not tolerate misbehaving children and that you will not shoot as long as they are acting up. Further more if they want to set up a second shooting they will have to pay up front for your time. Two hours is plenty of time to set something up and get the children to behave for some nice shots. If they do not turn out because of the children doing what you described it's your customers loss not yours.
Playing games and doing some of the things you did are fine for behavend children. For those other ones it is just another chance to misbehave. So no games, no candies, no toys you will just have to rund that shoot like a sergeant in the military and put down your foot as best you can. If the parents don't like it tough baloney they lost the money and maybe they learn to keep their children in check. Seems to me the father didn't want to do the whole thing anyway and the kids played up to the father. In a case like this I would point out that this is a family thing and if not everyone is part of it and willingly participates it is not worth even trying (and they lose their money anyway) Your time is money.

[dollykubz]

I think that sign is a wonderful idea, Sandee. I just started portraits about 4 months ago. I love it. I had children a week ago that were so mis-behaved, it was horrible. 2 hours I tried, and didn't get any good portraits of them. The parents brought the grandmother with them, and then a friend who had 2 children. So, 4 adults yelling at the children the whole time to smile, even when I politely told them not to. It was a mess. The oldest child was 3. I played all kinds of games, did all kinds of tricks, sang, etc... Nothing I did worked. The parents were very displeased with the portraits, and I did politely explain. I am going to do a reshoot next week. No extra people this time and I explained to the parents how important it is to work WITH me and not against me. The images were all sharp, clear, etc... But horrible facial expressions, etc... It was a huge learning experience for me. I am hanging up a sign this week.