Copyright question and more

[Minxes]

I do believe this will start a debat But what I am looking for is pro's and con's as well as a few straight answers.
If I am correct and someone please fix me if I am not, everything we take is automatically copyrighted the second we take it, but giving them the High res copy...
Does anyone here take pictures for people who wish to use the pictures on buisness cards? If so do you charge a usage fee? and why???
If you are taking family portraits, do you copyright/ or give High Res those to your customer? If so why or why not ??? Other then keeping them comming back to you to get them printed what are reasons you would copyright/give out the High res image of a family portrait?
I do understand copyrighting the picture I took of a sunset or tree etc...or a model that I took, as they will use it to make money them selves but why would you do a family who is just displaying there picture in their living room or giving it to other family members???

Also if you own your buisness, what software do you use for everything?? especially free stuff,lol. Looking for options and advice as we are starting our own buissness. Like many others on here Thank you for your advice and ideas.

Minxes

[Kheyo]

If you are taking family portraits, do you copyright those? If so why??? Other then keeping them comming back to you to get them printed what are reasons you would copyright a family portrait?

I would copyright the copy of the image you are keeping and displaying on your portfolio, if using a copy for your portfolio is something you agreed on with the family. That way you protect the image you are displaying.

Does anyone here take pictures for people who wish to use the pictures on buisness cards? If so do you charge a usage fee? and why???

I personally think a usage fee is complicated and would just charge normal time/fee, but that's me.

[JFSanders]

Originally Posted by Minxes

I do believe this will start a debat But what I am looking for is pro's and con's as well as a few straight answers.

Does anyone here take pictures for people who wish to use the pictures on buisness cards? If so do you charge a usage fee? and why???
If you are taking family portraits, do you copyright those? If so why??? Other then keeping them comming back to you to get them printed what are reasons you would copyright a family portrait?
I do understand copyrighting the picture I took of a sunset or tree etc...or a model that I took, as they will use it to make money them selves but why would you do a family who is just displaying there picture in their living room or giving it to other family members???

Also if you own your buisness, what software do you use for everything?? especially free stuff,lol. Looking for options and advice as we are starting our own buissness. Like many others on here Thank you for your advice and ideas.

Minxes

Ever heard the term, Starving Artist? They have all had the exact same outlook as you do. Not saying that it is good or bad but do understand that when you don't copyright you close the door on what ever rights you might have had FOREVER.

Jim

[Minxes]

Originally Posted by JFSanders

Ever heard the term, Starving Artist? They have all had the exact same outlook as you do. Not saying that it is good or bad but do understand that when you don't copyright you close the door on what ever rights you might have had FOREVER.

Jim

Jim,

There are and will be cartain pictures I believe in protecting my rights to, but not so sure the picture of a family or buisness card picture would be one of those. I do understand that someone can go get a bad print of a picture as not all printers are created equally lol but I am really curious as to good arguments or examples as to why I would want the rights besides of the ones I am keeping for my portfolio to some family or buisness card type picture. I woudl love to hear your reasonings.

Minxes

[JFSanders]

To put it more cleanly. I look at Copyright as a one way time line. Once you pass on a copyright and release the product you have no further recourse. To me it is free insurance. I can't tell the future and that family photo today may turn into history someday. Best to be safe.

Jim

[BuddhaPi]

copyright is established the second you press the shutter release, it's yours , you own it.. if you plan on releasing the copyright to "the family" or whomever, you'll need to do the paperwork releasing the copyright to them.. this equals more time, which is more overhead, and needs to be added into the cost of doing business, just as if you were going to register the images with the copyright office = more business expenses.

you might want to have a look at this...

http://copyright.gov/circs/circ01.pdf

[Minxes]

Thank You Buddha, I believe right now the question is weather or not we will release the HIgh Res images,. I do not believe will will release the copyright.

Minxes

[andyw]

Originally Posted by Minxes

I do believe this will start a debat But what I am looking for is pro's and con's as well as a few straight answers.
If I am correct and someone please fix me if I am not, everything we take is automatically copyrighted the second we take it, but giving them the High res copy...
Minxes

But giving a high res copy means nothing - copyright still rests with the photographer

Originally Posted by Minxes

Does anyone here take pictures for people who wish to use the pictures on buisness cards? If so do you charge a usage fee? and why???
Minxes

Yes and yes. why? because they are using the images. They are publicly displaying, they are copying and often they are altering it. For all those reasons you issue and charge a usage license. Often that is just built into the base pricing. For corporate portraits then I charge a day rate which includes an "internal use only" license.

Effectively you are charging a "usage" fee when someone is buying a single print from you. Just it is not listed as such. Buying a print ONLY gives the user the right to use it for personal display. Copyright forbids public display, copying, alteration etc of the image.

Originally Posted by Minxes

If you are taking family portraits, do you copyright/ or give High Res those to your customer? If so why or why not ??? Other then keeping them comming back to you to get them printed what are reasons you would copyright/give out the High res image of a family portrait?
Minxes

I don't do family portraiture but....
the images are already copyright (in most countries to the photographer) in the case of portrait commissions. Nothing wrong with giving out hi-res copies as long as they are priced at the correct price. If I was doing it then they would be priced at the same or more as the price of a single large print.
If you are doing that and letting them print etc then you issue a license .

Originally Posted by Minxes

I do understand copyrighting the picture I took of a sunset or tree etc...or a model that I took, as they will use it to make money them selves but why would you do a family who is just displaying there picture in their living room or giving it to other family members???
Minxes

Again, the picture is copyright to you as soon as you take it - as you mentioned at the start.
In the "old days" photographers made their money on prints and reprints. People did not manipulate the image themselves, they did not post them all over the internet, they (rarely) would use the image and make out that they were done by themselves etc.
These days they do, hence the reason why you need to be careful when dishing out digital files and when you do so you should be pricing at a rate which covers the various uses.

Originally Posted by Minxes

Also if you own your buisness, what software do you use for everything?? especially free stuff,lol. Looking for options and advice as we are starting our own buissness. Like many others on here Thank you for your advice and ideas.

Minxes

Lightroom and PS. for the photography, accounting package (sage) and a couple of other things for "running" the business "free stuff" is not worth the money


Bottom line, most people want or even expect digital files. Fine, let them have them but price everything accordingly.
If you do a large family group (mom/dad/kids/grandparents) then you should be expecting pretty good sales The parents want copies, the grandparents(both sets) want copies, possibly aunts and uncles want copies.
So in the "old days" of prints you would be expecting to do at least $/£1000-2000+ in prints of various sizes and framed/unframed.
Now if you give the parents a disc then they pass on to all and sundry and you lose out if you don't price correctly.

Copyright does not come into anything really as it rests with the photographer (in most circumstances).
If you give out files then ensure you also give out a license which details what the client can do with the images.

[mokka]

Originally Posted by Minxes

I do understand copyrighting the picture I took of a sunset or tree etc...or a model that I took, as they will use it to make money them selves but why would you do a family who is just displaying there picture in their living room or giving it to other family members???

Because once you give the copyright to someone then the law is on their side and if they wanted they could stop you from using the photo in other things, or even displaying it in your portfolio. Taken to an extreme, imagine if every client you worked for, you gave the copyright to and then they said you weren't allowed to use the photo in your own portfolio/promotions. You would be perpetually stuck at the entry level of the market, with no portfolio to make you stand out against the crowd.

Photographers who do habitually give out copyrights to all their clients, often point out that they put a clause in the contract that says they are allowed to use the photograph for their own promotion, but as they say, possession is nine-tenths of the law, once you own the copyright you are in the driving seat and contractual agreements are easily invalidated.

People can be funny animals where issues of privacy are involved. Most people who have a session with a photographer have no issue with the idea that the photographer will display the photographs in the portfolio, but as soon as they get a whiff of copyright law, suddenly they feel personally violated and will go to great lengths to prevent something they would otherwise be happy with.

[SierraPhotog]

First, you own the copyright to any image you take until you sell or give the rights away. If you are under a work-for-hire contract you most likely do NOT own the rights. Second, you should *REGISTER* (not "copyright") any images you may sell/publish at any point in the future. Failing to register your images via copyright.gov seriously limits any damages awarded in court. Third, how you choose to supply those images to your paying client is your business, but if you supply digital copies you should make it clear in writing that you are granting them a use license depending upon whatever rights you are selling them. And above all else, price your images based on what it'll be used for: personal Facebook album, business cards, public flyers, catalogs, etc.

SteveB