Weeklong rental and sessions

[drummingpariah]

I'm an amateur photographer (hobbyist). I've made money with photography consistently, booked shoots, and sold prints, but I am far from a professional or semi-professional photographer.

Now that that's out in the open, I have a tentative plan to bridge the gap between hobbyist and professional. From my perspective, there's a fine line between the two, and most of it has to do with how you present, brand, and market yourself as a photographer. Professionals have set rates that make sense, terms and conditions, and experience making things good. Hobbyists charge 'what they feel like at the time' (or even worse, whatever the client feels it's worth) and are seldom well-prepared and professional at a shoot.

The problem:

I shoot with a Nikon d40x. It's a fine camera, in almost every way, but it's decidedly consumer/prosumer and makes getting the 'right shot' difficult. I shoot a lot of low-light, fast-action events, and while I end up with fairly good results (in my humble opinion), I'm being held back by the quality of the gear I'm using.
However, gear is expensive. Most of the venues I shoot don't allow flash, so I'm basically looking at a full-frame body with fast glass as the logical upgrade. I've been through a lot of different options, but around $5k new looks like the price for a full kit to get me on my feet. I may be able to get away with around $3k or so used/frugal, but either way it's a large investment for something I'm not entirely sure I'd continue to enjoy in a professional capacity.

The proposed solution:

Book a week full of sessions, get sizeable deposits, and rent the gear I'm considering for a week. It looks like the Canon 5d mkii is the logical body to go with, along with either a f1.2 or f1.4 85mm lens, battery grip, and spare battery. Rental for 7 days is roughly $500, and I'm planning 10 sessions (2/day @ $250/each), and max each session out at 4 hours. From what I've seen, that's a VERY competitive rate. The last 2 days of the week are scheduled as rain makeup days, in case the weather gets bad.

The end result:

I get to dip my toe in the water of professional photography (with professional gear) without completely investing myself, to see if it's even something I'm ACTUALLY interested in (trying to be honest with myself at this point, and as certain as I am that I'll love it, I won't know until I try). I also get to try the 5d to make sure it's even a body that I can work with. I don't have experience with Canon, and while I've seen phenomenal results from many, many photographers using it, I may not be capable of getting those same results. The final bonus is that I would make a bit of money doing it. In total, I'd receive $2500 for the sessions, minus the ~$500 for renting gear, and another $100 in travel expenses (estimated) leaves me with around $1900 for a week's worth of work (plus a considerable amount of time dedicated to marketing/branding, but that's difficult to evaluate accurately). Not too shabby, I'd say.

So really, I'm looking for feedback from you awesome, experienced folks here. If this really takes off, I'll continue booking these sessions every month or every other month, until I've plunked enough quarters into my piggy bank from this to purchase all the gear I'd need outright.

[3bayjunkie]

This is what I plan on doing for my first wedding shoot. I am going to charge the rented gear to the client. however im shooting the wedding for free and also charging for prints and album. The gear i need to rent is an extra camera body Nikon D7000 ($99/wk), a Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8 VR II ($99/wk) and I'll use my already aquired Nikkor 50mm f/1.4 Ai ($65 on ebay after shipping) and my Nikkor 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6 for wide angle which I purchased new with my Nikon D7000 Kit ($1859 on Amazon)

I plan to bring four batteries total, ten 4gb memory cards (half will be back up cards as the D7000 has two SD slots). I will also have one Nikon SB700 flash and one or two of the Sony 20w video lights. This is all i need as i mainly do natural light photography and the wedding and reception will be during the day. The wedding is outdoors and the reception is indoors.

Alaska Heavenly Lodge :: Home
this is where the wedding is going to be, the reception is inside the log cabin lodge. There is a lake nearby with a mountain view, should be a pretty wedding.

So to answer your question. Yes I agree with your decision to rent gear. Thats a great Idea. Where will you be renting from? There isn't anywhere local where I live in Alaska so i will be renting from online.

[drummingpariah]

I'll have my d40x and d80 as backup bodies, along with an array of lenses I already own for them, but the plan is not to use them at all.

I've been looking at Rent professional cameras or camera lenses for Canon, Nikon, Sony, Olympus, Leica and Pentax for my rentals, since they appear to have the best prices (from what I've seen), and here's a list of what I'm planning to rent (so far):

1. 5d mkii - $199 (includes insurance)
2. Canon EF 85mm f/1.2L II USM - $95 (includes insurance)
3. Spare battery - $24
4. Battery Grip - $40

for a total of $358 for the entire week. Depending upon what type of sessions I end up booking, I'll rent another lens or two, but in general I've found that a single GOOD prime lens suits all my needs. I'm a HUGE fan of my 50mm f1.4 on the d40x/d80, and based on my rudimentary calculations, they should be pretty close to equal.

I'll have around 4 hours to recharge the batteries between sessions, and I should get around 1500 exposures out of it, then AA's as backups (just in case). I'd like to think I can make that work.

That wedding sounds like a lot of stress (all weddings are, for everyone who's even remotely involved), but a LOT of fun. I'd be much more comfortable bankrolling the rental cost if I were certain some prints would be ordered (weddings are a pretty sure thing), but otherwise it sounds like we both have a pretty similar plan.

[3bayjunkie]

Originally Posted by drummingpariah

I'll have my d40x and d80 as backup bodies, along with an array of lenses I already own for them, but the plan is not to use them at all.

I've been looking at Rent professional cameras or camera lenses for Canon, Nikon, Sony, Olympus, Leica and Pentax for my rentals, since they appear to have the best prices (from what I've seen), and here's a list of what I'm planning to rent (so far):

1. 5d mkii - $199 (includes insurance)
2. Canon EF 85mm f/1.2L II USM - $95 (includes insurance)
3. Spare battery - $24
4. Battery Grip - $40

for a total of $358 for the entire week. Depending upon what type of sessions I end up booking, I'll rent another lens or two, but in general I've found that a single GOOD prime lens suits all my needs. I'm a HUGE fan of my 50mm f1.4 on the d40x/d80, and based on my rudimentary calculations, they should be pretty close to equal.

I'll have around 4 hours to recharge the batteries between sessions, and I should get around 1500 exposures out of it, then AA's as backups (just in case). I'd like to think I can make that work.

That wedding sounds like a lot of stress (all weddings are, for everyone who's even remotely involved), but a LOT of fun. I'd be much more comfortable bankrolling the rental cost if I were certain some prints would be ordered (weddings are a pretty sure thing), but otherwise it sounds like we both have a pretty similar plan.

I wouldn't even bother renting the battery grip. it really isn't neccisary. The only think I find them useful for is getting a higher burst rate. if you have an extra battery you can just charge one while using the other. I don't see a need for it, plus it just makes the camera heavier.

[inkista]

Grips are a matter of personal preference, and how often you use the camera in portrait mode. I hate 'em, but I have little girl hands and RSI-compromised grip strength; I have a shooting buddy who can't use a dSLR comfortably without a grip. I would say, however, that the 5Dii is substantially larger and heavier than a D40x, and to take that into account.

Also, a word of caution. The 85L is a gorgeous lens, and completely drool-worthy, but nailing focus with an f/1.2 lens wide open takes a good bit of practice. I would not blithely mount it to the front of a camera and then take off for a paid shoot with it. It is also one honking BIG hunk of glass. There's a reason it's nicknamed "The Canonball". Practice with it like hell before going on a shoot. You may think you know wide apertures with an f/1.8 lens, and that one stop won't make that much difference. I thought that too. Then I got an f/1.2 lens (albeit not an L).

Add in the fact that you're going to have to learn Canon button and menu layout, and I would recommend that you consider renting a 135L instead, if you can't rent for long enough to have at least a day's worth of practice. The 135L gives just as creamy bokeh and thin DoF, and it's got a lightning fast AF to boot.

Just remember. An 85 on a 5Dii will frame like a 50 does on an APS-C. And a 135 on full-frame will frame like an 85 does on an APS-C. Given that your chosen lens on the D40x is an 85/1.8, the 135/2 might actually feel "closer to home" for you on a 5Dii. Bonus, it's about half the price of an 85L.

In Canon gearhead forums, you'll hear of the "Holy Trinity" of L primes: the 35L, the 85L, and the 135L. (Yes, yes, the 50L is good, too, but it has focus shift, which makes it more of PITA than the other three if you like stopping down on occasion).

[drummingpariah]

I don't even see saving 30 seconds of changing batteries as an advantage to the battery grip. My reason for wanting one is the stability it affords. The added weight on the very bottom of the camera helps hold me steady, and the extended grip and vertical shot capability is absolutely worth the extra money. I typically find tripods to be cumbersome and limiting, and end up shooting freehand much more often than not.

Now, I know the 5d is a very different physical form factor than the d40x or d80, and it may just fit nicely and snugly in my hand and I won't need the battery grip after all. I'd still prefer to have it (and the ability to use AA's in a pinch) than not.

[drummingpariah]

First-hand experience is invaluable, I can't thank you enough.

Originally Posted by inkista

Grips are a matter of personal preference, and how often you use the camera in portrait mode. I hate 'em, but I have little girl hands and RSI-compromised grip strength; I have a shooting buddy who can't use a dSLR comfortably without a grip. I would say, however, that the 5Dii is substantially larger and heavier than a D40x, and to take that into account.

Also, a word of caution. The 85L is a gorgeous lens, and completely drool-worthy, but nailing focus with an f/1.2 lens wide open takes a good bit of practice. I would not blithely mount it to the front of a camera and then take off for a paid shoot with it. It is also one honking BIG hunk of glass. There's a reason it's nicknamed "The Canonball". Practice with it like hell before going on a shoot. You may think you know wide apertures with an f/1.8 lens, and that one stop won't make that much difference. I thought that too. Then I got an f/1.2 lens (albeit not an L).

I'm not going to say I'm a master, but I've only ever shot manual focus in manual mode(the d40 really doesn't autofocus with many lenses at all). I'd say I'm experienced. The 85mm f/1.8 is pretty much my default, but I have another 50mm f/1.4 that I've absolutely fallen in love with. If the difference between f/1.8 and f/1.4 is the same as the difference between f/1.4 and f/1.2 I'll be OK... but that brings me to my next point/question:

In my experience so far, lenses capable of wider apertures tend to be much more crisp than those made for narrower apertures, and I like having the capability to go crazy-wide-open if I decide to lose my mind and only want a few inches of focal depth (not very useful, in the real/professional world, it's more fun than anything).

Originally Posted by inkista

Add in the fact that you're going to have to learn Canon button and menu layout, and I would recommend that you consider renting a 135L instead, if you can't rent for long enough to have at least a day's worth of practice. The 135L gives just as creamy bokeh and thin DoF, and it's got a lightning fast AF to boot.

The buttons/menus are a huge consideration, but I haven't really found a way around that. As long as I can set my ISO, set my aperture, then have on-the-fly access to change my shutter speed, I'm a happy camper.

Originally Posted by inkista

Just remember. An 85 on a 5Dii will frame like a 50 does on an APS-C. And a 135 on full-frame will frame like an 85 does on an APS-C. Given that your chosen lens on the D40x is an 85/1.8, the 135/2 might actually feel "closer to home" for you on a 5Dii. Bonus, it's about half the price of an 85L.

Duly noted. I've done a bunch of reading to actually wrap my head around crop factors, and now I've actually got the physics of how cameras work burned into my brain. I prefer to shoot with my 50mm on the x1.5 bodies, so the 85mm on a full-frame sounds like it'd be a comfy place for me to hang out. I definitely think you're right though, and that I should add the 135 into this order.

Originally Posted by inkista

In Canon gearhead forums, you'll hear of the "Holy Trinity" of L primes: the 35L, the 85L, and the 135L. (Yes, yes, the 50L is good, too, but it has focus shift, which makes it more of PITA than the other three if you like stopping down on occasion).

Sounds solid to me. That sounds like a perfect lens combo to me! I really appreciate the advice, even though I'm sure it's a very common question that's been beaten to death a million times (I'm seeing a lot of people repeat the same questions over and over in my searches).

[inkista]

Originally Posted by drummingpariah

I'm not going to say I'm a master, but I've only ever shot manual focus in manual mode(the d40 really doesn't autofocus with many lenses at all). I'd say I'm experienced. The 85mm f/1.8 is pretty much my default, but I have another 50mm f/1.4 that I've absolutely fallen in love with. If the difference between f/1.8 and f/1.4 is the same as the difference between f/1.4 and f/1.2 I'll be OK...

Ummm.... it's not.

Think of it as the difference between nailing focus with a DoF measured in cm, vs. one that's measured in mm. My f/1.2 is a manual focus lens, and my focus screen didn't display the DoF accurately, which was my biggest issue. I've had to swap the focus screen in my 5Dii to the "super-precision matte" to nail the focus.


50D, adapted Olympus OM 50mm f/1.2.

On the 5dii, the DoF is even thinner than that. And that's just a 50mm. With an 85/1.2, it'll be even thinner. You're used to f/1.8 and f/1.4 on a crop body. But everybody's skill level at this is different. Hopefully f/1.2 won't be as much trouble for you as it was for me.

In my experience so far, lenses capable of wider apertures tend to be much more crisp than those made for narrower apertures,

Actually, my experience is the other way around, particularly wide open. But all lenses are individual. An f/1.2 has a lot more demands on it to stay sharp. Don't expect miracles. Nearly every lens requires being stopped down a little to achieve maximum sharpness.

...The buttons/menus are a huge consideration, but I haven't really found a way around that. As long as I can set my ISO, set my aperture, then have on-the-fly access to change my shutter speed, I'm a happy camper.

This will definitely be easier to do. The dual-wheel controls on any prosumer dSLR are a big step up from the single wheel and modal button on an entry-level body, regardless of brand.

Have fun with the toys!!

[drummingpariah]

Originally Posted by inkista

Ummm.... it's not.

I'll be right back, I know I'll need a notebook for any post that begins like this.

Originally Posted by inkista

Think of it as the difference between nailing focus with a DoF measured in cm, vs. one that's measured in mm. My f/1.2 is a manual focus lens, and my focus screen didn't display the DoF accurately, which was my biggest issue. I've had to swap the focus screen in my 5Dii to the "super-precision matte" to nail the focus.

Sounds like a huge pain. I've noticed that the DoF on my f/1.8 is about 2' further away than the viewfinder 'says' it is, and I eventually trained myself to compensate for that. My f/1.4 appears to be pretty dead-on, so that's required less retraining/modification to nail down.

Originally Posted by inkista

On the 5dii, the DoF is even thinner than that. And that's just a 50mm. With an 85/1.2, it'll be even thinner. You're used to f/1.8 and f/1.4 on a crop body. But everybody's skill level at this is different. Hopefully f/1.2 won't be as much trouble for you as it was for me.

I hadn't even considered that there would be a DoF difference between a crop body and a full-frame body. That sure throws a wrench into the works.

Originally Posted by inkista

Actually, my experience is the other way around, particularly wide open. But all lenses are individual. An f/1.2 has a lot more demands on it to stay sharp. Don't expect miracles. Nearly every lens requires being stopped down a little to achieve maximum sharpness.

I may very well be wrong, in general. I'm only basing my experience on the dozen lenses or so that I've had on my limited range of crop Nikon bodies. I'm certainly not working off a vast array of data here. That's a big part of why I appreciate every bit of experience and advice someone offers me. Not only does it fill in holes in my knowledge, but it also shows me just how small my "world" of photography is.

Originally Posted by inkista

This will definitely be easier to do. The dual-wheel controls on any prosumer dSLR are a big step up from the single wheel and modal button on an entry-level body, regardless of brand.

Well, the d40x is the only body I've used that only has a single wheel, and while I do love having that second wheel, it doesn't actually save me much time. For the most part, I find that I set my aperture and ISO, then work out the correct shutter speed based upon that. I really only need the wheel for the shutter speed. Am I plain old missing something? Shooting with the d3 body really didn't feel like a big change as far as the controls went. Nor was the d700 or d300. I imagine that the 5d will be completely different, simply because Canon has no reason to create any consistency with Nikon.

Originally Posted by inkista

Have fun with the toys!!

I'm still super excited to have the f/1.2 as an option, and will definitely snag one, but my expectations are a little more grounded now. It's a much bigger change than just swapping the f/1.8 for the f/1.4 on the exact same body, and I hadn't really been thinking of it that way.

Some positive news: I've already booked 2 sessions and collected the prepayment! I'm about as excited as I can be without actually peeing myself right now.

[BK553]

I think the entire plan is based on picking up a camera that is radically different than what you use, and making money with it in a "professional" setting a couple days after you get is a fools errand. A professional doesn't pick up a camera an expect it to just work, they know their equipment without even looking at it. It looks like you've read a ton of stuff, and have a pretty good technical understanding. That's good. But having experience with a camera, knowing it's intricacies and quirks, and having the confidence that you've done it a million times before goes much further, in my opinion.