Giving RAW files for free?

[chjang]

I've recently connected with a wedding photographer and he let me tag along to a couple of his engagement shoots. He made it clear that he would just "train" me (in other words, not pay me) for the time being, until I got more experience.

He told me to upload my photos from the engagement shoots online to my Flickr or Picasa so he could critique them, so I did. He not only didn't critique anything, but he also asked for the full-res, RAW files for the images, and asked me to mail him a DVD if I can't find a way to get it online. Is this normal? Why do I get the feeling that he's trying to cheat me by using my photos as if they're his? Shouldn't I at least be getting paid if he's asking me for the RAW files?

[Rentham]

No it's not normal. Go with your instincts. Something stinks here.

[High_Speed]

Ditto, something stinks here. I would politely ask him why he needs the RAW files. If he wants to critique them, he can do that with lower resolution JPGs. If he wants the RAW files for any other reason, well....I can't think of any other reason that would be legitimate.......

[Niresangwa]

It's not all that unusual for a lead to use an assistant's images... it would be weird if he agreed he wouldn't be doing that though.

When I use an assistant, their images become mine under the terms of our agreement, and they are paid. Any images I take from their cards may be offered up to the clients, but will not be used in my online portfolio. Once I'm done with their cards, they are released back to them to use them as they see fit.

I guess I'm just trying to convey that it's not a black and white area, and really comes down to the understanding that is reached between you two.

Pretty simple idea that you get tutelage and access to his clients, he gets access to your files.

[Rentham]

Originally Posted by Rentham

No it's not normal. Go with your instincts. Something stinks here.

After reading the original post again, I must have missed the part where you mentioned the engagement session was with his clients. In that case, yes it is normal for him to have the files. I thought it was a shoot you did and he was critiquing to see if he wanted to bring you along.

[chjang]

Originally Posted by Rentham

After reading the original post again, I must have missed the part where you mentioned the engagement session was with his clients. In that case, yes it is normal for him to have the files. I thought it was a shoot you did and he was critiquing to see if he wanted to bring you along.

But is it still normal even if he's not paying me at all?

I don't know if it changes anything, but he did give me the opportunity to tag along with him, he bought me a couple meals, and let me use his camera and lens.

[UlpilotSC]

Sounds a lot like an internship, where businesses get the benefit of free labor, and students get some real world knowledge. Colleges do it all the time.

I think before you go on another one of these sessions you need to talk about what the expectations are.

[oldwolf]

Seems normal to me if you're second shooting with him and/or interning with him.

I agree with Nire. We backup their cards to our devices and give them their cards back. We'll process the pictures for the client but will not use them in our port because we didn't take the pictures. Our second shoot can use the images that they took in their port.

For weddings, if they're second shooting and not getting paid then they don't shoot formals. If we pay them then they get to shoot some formals only because we don't like shooting formals unless their pretty laid back and want to have fun with the whole formal shots thing.

[BexJarratt]

I think I'd probably phone him and ask to bring them round and if he could show me which ones he was interested in and let me watch how he was going to process them. If he was confrontational about that, then I'd think he was trying to swindle me and that's be my last shoot with him, if he was open to that, I'd think he was going to be a useful teacher and stick with it.

This is me speaking from a personal perspective, I've no experience shooting with a photographer or on an arranged shoot in this way.

[cyber3d]

Not a pro here, but, give him the raw files.

You got the experience of shooting on a real assignment, he let you use his equipment (man, he must trust you!) and since you are a beginning wedding photographer (he bought you lunch too? - man I wish I had gofered for guys like that!) then, it's not like you are likely to have images that he can use for the job, that look like his style, that he would claim were his shots. And if you ever want to learn more fromt his guy - give it to him.

When you've payed your dues for a while, then you can start to question his request.