Non Professional Pricing?

[AdrenoJunkie]

Due to a recent lay off, well timed opportunities, and the positive responses I got from this thread Dilemma: Am I ready to charge? I've decided to take a chance and start charging for my photography, at least for the time being. The way I came up with pricing is based on me not wanting to feel like I am ripping people off for less than professional quality and to guarantee that my clients walk away happy thereby not ruining my reputation for down the road when I do go pro. My plan is to charge $10 per image to be put on a cd. They only pay for the images they want, if they don't want any they don't pay. I'm going to be upfront that this price is because I am not a professional and that down the road it will be changing. I know this is not a good professional business model, but I'm not a professional and this is not a business. It's simply a way to help me out right now. Under normal cicumstances I would happily do this for free for the experience. So any money I make is worth it. I may charge an extra fee if I have to drive somewhere for an outdoor shoot to cover my gas. Now my question for all of you is, based on all of this can you see any major reason why I shouldn't do it like this? And if so do you have a better way?

[OsmosisStudios]

All I can say is good luck: with that business model you're gonna need a gigantic pile of horseshoes and 4-leaf clovers.

[AdrenoJunkie]

Originally Posted by OsmosisStudios

All I can say is good luck: with that business model you're gonna need a gigantic pile of horseshoes and 4-leaf clovers.

Haha thanks. Like I said, this isn't meant to be a business model per say. I'm not looking to make a living off of it right now. Just to supplement myself. I know this would never work as an actual business. But seeing as how my work is not professional quality I have no business trying to be a business and charging people professional prices. Also, seeing as how I would normally do all of these shoots for free then anything I make off of it is profit in my book. I'm open to other ideas, That's just the best I could come up with that would put money in my pocket now and not be shooting myself in the foot later when I do try to make a business out of it. If you follow my link above that post has a link to some of my best work. Take a look and tell me how you would go about it if you were at the level that I'm at now.

[Rentham]

Let's say I hire you to do some family portraits. But I live about 45 minutes away, and want them done in a park close to my house. There's no way I'm paying you an extra travel fee since you've been very up front with me about how you aren't a professional. So I'm keeping this on the cheap since you don't seem very confident in your work.

The portrait session takes an hour, after which you return home. Since you're smart enough not to show unedited photos you do some preliminary RAW adjustments before you put them up in a web galley for me to look at. (And how much a month are you paying for your web hosting or portfolio service?)

At this point you've already invested around 5 hours between packing your gear up, travel, the shoot, and some basic post work. You haven't made any money yet.

If I buy 1 image, you've made 2 dollars an hour. Ah, but you now have to ship me the DVD. And you're not just going to send me a blank DVD labeled in marker in a paper folder are you? So now you've lost money on this shoot. And wasted valuable time you could have been using to either a) enhance your skills or b) develop a real business plan.

My recommendations: Stop apologizing for your work. Stop thinking that not being a "professional" in any way diminishes a client's expectations. Stop using it as an excuse to do things cheap and easy. Stop being ashamed to make money. Would you be ashamed to collect your paycheck from a day job? Does your client turn down their salary because they aren't the best in their field?

Working for $10 isn't better than working for free. When you work for free you can do whatever you want. You dictate the terms. The second you ask for money, your focus is now producing for the client.

[Niresangwa]

Originally Posted by Rentham

My recommendations: Stop apologizing for your work. Stop thinking that not being a "professional" in any way diminishes a client's expectations. Stop using it as an excuse to do things cheap and easy. Stop being ashamed to make money. Would you be ashamed to collect your paycheck from a day job? Does your client turn down their salary because they aren't the best in their field?

Working for $10 isn't better than working for free. When you work for free you can do whatever you want. You dictate the terms. The second you ask for money, your focus is now producing for the client.

This is a great reply.

The constant self-doubt and apologizing is going to kill you, especially when the stuff you have posted is perfectly acceptable given the apparent consumer standard these days.

Without a boatload of confidence, and even a touch of arrogance, how can you expect anyone to take you seriously?

If I"d seen the work you had posted and been told you charged a couple of hundred bucks for a shoot, I wouldn;t have flinched. Hearing you're going to be happy to devote a whole days worth of work or more for a few bucks on the other hand, is just ridiculous.

It doesn't matter that you're not looking to make a living wage at it. Heck, maybe you could do it, but with this attitude, you definitely won't.

You remind me of me when I first thought about doing this. If I could go back and talk to myself, I'd kick myself right in the balls for risking *not* having what I have now. Making the decision to either do this properly or not at all was the best decision I ever made in my life, period.

Don't risk "2013 AdrenoJunkie" coming back and hoofing you in the nuts for being a flake.

[RLucas]

Originally Posted by Niresangwa

You remind me of me when I first thought about doing this. If I could go back and talk to myself, I'd kick myself right in the balls for risking *not* having what I have now. Making the decision to either do this properly or not at all was the best decision I ever made in my life, period.

Don't risk "2013 AdrenoJunkie" coming back and hoofing you in the nuts for being a flake.

Thanks for saying this Steve. The lack of confidence is something that I wrestle with myself daily over. I have passed up probably several thousand dollars worth of work just because of this. I am, at this moment, kicking myself in the balls.

[Jim Bryant]

Sorry you were laid off, however, you are KILLING the profession by only charging $10.00 per image. If you feel you aren't up to par experience wise then collect unemployment and let the state pay for your school or retraining, Don't undercharge the market. It's bad enough out here without adding another photographer who doesn't know what the hell they are doing.

[JFSanders]

Anyone who is successful at business first sells himself and the client gets a photograph included in the purchase! Do your best always. Do not work for free unless it is for your mother. Even Dad pays...

If you do not know how much it will cost you to produce an image, then you cannot honestly hope to make a go of it. It isn't enough to make great pictures, that is why starving artists is such a well known stereotype.

Jim

[Jim Poor]

Originally Posted by AdrenoJunkie

Haha thanks. Like I said, this isn't meant to be a business model per say. I'm not looking to make a living off of it right now. Just to supplement myself.

The problem is you won't be supplementing anything. You'll be taking a loss, which doesn't help your current situation one bit.

[Tzetsin]

Originally Posted by Jim Bryant

Sorry you were laid off, however, you are KILLING the profession by only charging $10.00 per image.

"Photography" for pay isnt a "Hobby"
"Photography" for pay isnt for "fun"
"Photography" for pay isnt for "just a little while"
"Photography" for pay isnt even "photography".

"Photography" for pay is a BUSINESS.

I dont think you understand what it is your proposing here. You sound like you think that your just going to hang out your sign that says "cheap pics here" and people are going to come knocking on your door. You might get some family at first, meby some family friends after that, but after that... NOTHING. Why? because your running a business, but not RUNNING the business.

Most businesses make zero profit for the first couple years, but that doesnt mean it doesnt take CAPITAL. Your likely going to need to buy equipment, INSURANCE (most people forget about this, dont you dare open for business without it!) software (if you dont have LEGAL copies of it) You'll need to buy yourself a printer or all your "profits" will go to the print shop. Your going to have to have a business license.

After your set up with all that you need, your going to have to have a WORK FLOW. one that you can depend on to get your goods out fast. There will be no more sitting on one picture for 3 days diddleing with this and that. its "in, couple sliders, out" or you'll just get behind (assuming you even get customers)

You have to have a business model. Rate plans. A method of showing your work.

You have to be willing to make a gazillion phone calls. (thats the part of business i hate the most...) Even calls to people who DONT want to talk to you. Enjoy.

And finally once that is all set up and ready....

You have to ADVERTISE. and THAT doesnt come CHEAP. Not by any stretch. and you WILL FAIL if you dont. Thats why they charge so much.... they got you by the short ones.

All said. Assuming you have most of the photography equipment already, you're looking at at the very LEAST 10 grand just to accept your first customer. and that is a very very generous figure.

I'm not trying to disuade you in the least. I'm just hoping to illistrate what the OTHER photographers have had to do to open their doors. And what YOU will have to do to open YOURS.

What your proposing is not in the least a casual thing.

I also want you to note that in this entire post I've never even mentioned ANYTHING about taking pictures.

I would like you to do yourself a favour and search this forum for maxharvard. Read some of his posts. Notice how arrogant he his. (no offense meant max ;D ) THIS IS THE ATTITUDE YOU NEED IN BUSINESS. You need to KNOW you are the best. You need to be able to answer your phone and tell your customer that they are damn lucky you had an opening that day or they might have had to go to one of those other inferior photographers. (more tactfully than that though of course )

If you are NOT willing to do ALL THIS AND MORE. Find some other way to make money.

My number one life motto. ALL OR F@CKING NOTHING.

In business, there is NO other motto.