Swimming Photos - Pricing ?

[shiroutsuki]

OK so I'm green and all, into swimming competitions and plan on getting a better pair of lenses. Basically, I was wondering about pricing. I originally toyed with the idea of selling a photo at a dollar each at most, but then a parent suggested $20.00 since at the provincial championships, there was a professional photographer that was apparently selling photographs of their children to interested parents for $85.00. IDK how many photos though for $85, but I did see parents going through photos on his computer as I passed by his stall.
Thank you! (:

[Niresangwa]

As a former swimming coach at the national level (both USAS and NCAA), here are a few things to chew on...

firstly, I assume you have a deck pass for this from the local governing body? I'll also assume that you're cleared by not only the team hosting the meet but also the facility they're hosting at to do so? You're using the term 'provincial' so i'm guessing you're not in the US I know that here in the US you're not even making it on deck during the meet without a USAS credential.

I ask this because shooting from the deck is really the only place to get decent shots like this. Shooting from stands makes for a very hard time, depending on your equipment you're going to be needing a monopod. The best place to shoot again depends hugely on what the event is... fly and breast you need to get low and roughly 45 degrees to the athlete, free and back, you need a little more height...if this is short course you're in for a looong day.. long course a little easier to get positions.

Lighting, again, a tough prospect if the pool is indoors. Flash at the start is a no-no period. During the race would be fine, but you definitely need it. Great swimming portraits require everything to be frozen, athlete and water and a DoF that will isolate the athlete and calm down the distractions in the other lanes and on the deck.

Anyways, I guess you didnt ask for advice on how to shoot competitive swimmers so apologies for the digression..

As far as price, I think providing your shots are of a decent quality, most vendors I've seen at State or Sectional level meets between $10 and $20 per shot. It all depends. $85USD for a 8x10 at a high level meet and of course with it being a killer shot (think right off the blocks, or fly mid-recovery) sounds about right... generally though you might want to start around $10-$15 for the file. You'd probably get a lot of takers for that.

You may wish to take out a sign up sheet prior to the sessions, ESPECIALLY finals at your booth - when parents know their kid made finals, they're usually pretty pumped and if you know in advance which event, lane and final they're in, you can set up in advance to cover them.. once you have them you can shoot around at the other swimmers - obviously they pay more for this, but you can design a mini-package or something. I know a couple of guys that do this. Prelims they generally shoot en masse, Finals they fill up with specific orders.

Also make sure you have a gallery to post the images to after the event and have cards available at your stand so people know where to go to get them after the meet. You can also contact the teams involved directly after the meet and let them know - they're probably happy to post the link on their site or include it in the greensheet or newsletter... your post-event sales will probably be better than during the event.

well, that should be enough to get you going.

Maybe Jim Poor will chime in, he's a big time Dog Sport photographer and though the events are different, i'm sure he has some great tips as an event photographer.

[shiroutsuki]

WOAH! Lots to chew on much!? Deck pass? Local governing body? Cleared? (; O[]O)!!! HUGE shock for me because the way I've been getting my photos is by squatting by the timers, occupying the empty blocks, sitting by the announcer's table, and sitting under the coach's tables! $: Well, the one exception was at one meet, a official told me to go to the host of the meet or whatever for permission and long story short, I did- can't remember why though. (^^)"
Oh, that's very helpful information- a little more height for free and back, didn't realize that. SCM takes forever, true that! :P
Talk about missing out! $: I didn't realize that one could use flash DURING the race... (; T__T)
I just wanted to ask though, 'right off the blocks' as in a dive, correct? Oh my, ten to fifteen dollars... wicked! :3
I'm confused, what did you mean by 'shoot around at the other swimmers'? (; @@)
Whew, a stall, cards, and all! /(; ^ ~ ^)\ Honestly haven't thought of setting one up myself as I'm a complete greenhorn, but whew! X)

Thanks for replying, I learned a ton!

[Jim Bryant]

Here in the U.S. the only swimming event where flash is prohibited is during the diving competition.

[Niresangwa]

That's true Jim, but using flash imminent to the start is going to quickly get you disliked. The starting horn uses both an audible signal and a strobe flash. The less imposing you are at an event the easier it is to do your job.

If you want starting block shots, you either hold off the flash, or you get the shot before the 'take your marks' command is issued by the starter. All it takes is a semi-aware coach to point the finger at the photographer using flash on a false start and you're going to get chastised. Were it one of my athletes, I'd do whatever I could not to have them charged with a FS... the photographer would be a great way to do that.

Better to get a couple as the mount the block after the whistle, then save it for the actual dive post signal. More dramatic images and safe to use flash.

[Niresangwa]

Originally Posted by shiroutsuki

WOAH! Lots to chew on much!? Deck pass? Local governing body? Cleared? (; O[]O)!!! HUGE shock for me because the way I've been getting my photos is by squatting by the timers, occupying the empty blocks, sitting by the announcer's table, and sitting under the coach's tables! $: Well, the one exception was at one meet, a official told me to go to the host of the meet or whatever for permission and long story short, I did- can't remember why though. (^^)"
Oh, that's very helpful information- a little more height for free and back, didn't realize that. SCM takes forever, true that! :P
Talk about missing out! $: I didn't realize that one could use flash DURING the race... (; T__T)
I just wanted to ask though, 'right off the blocks' as in a dive, correct? Oh my, ten to fifteen dollars... wicked! :3
I'm confused, what did you mean by 'shoot around at the other swimmers'? (; @@)
Whew, a stall, cards, and all! /(; ^ ~ ^)\ Honestly haven't thought of setting one up myself as I'm a complete greenhorn, but whew! X)

Thanks for replying, I learned a ton!

Well, again, I don't know where you're located and doing this and can only speak to the way it would have to be done in the US. Though I'm guessing most countries where olympic sports are highly organised are going to have similar processes.

Basically, the higher tier the meet is, the more formalities you're going to have to satisfy. The place to start would be check first of all with the national governing body as to whether you need to register with them. Here in the US, (with the exception of volunteer timers and facility lifeguards) you're not getting on deck at a meet of any heft without a USA Swimming credential. Almost all meets of any size have security that will require you to show your card (athletes, coaches, officials, all of them) - and if you're going to make any money off of this, bigger meets are where its at. In the US you need to submit to a background check and it also covers liability on deck.

Once you have established whether you need this r not, you need to figure out which meet you want to cover. Find out which team is hosting it (usually one of the bigger teams in the area) and contact them as a vendor. Vendors always show up at meets - usually one selling supplies and equipment, and also clothing vendors. The way we did it was the vendors paid us a cut of their profits. That should give you a table to work at. As far as what they'll take to allow you in there, thats negotiable and might be enough to offer them images of their athletes.

Now all you have to do is not get in anyones way. While at a wedding or whatever the photographer kind of has carte blanche, at a meet like this, you're literally at the bottom of the totem pole, just remember that.

get a hold of the heat sheet and figure out where you want to be and when. Again, free and back events, get into the stands if you can. Backstroke, you'll need to shoot from behind the swimmer and high, freestyle 90 degrees to them roughly. Breast and fly you need to be deck level and low, a good spot is the corner of the pool, shooting diagonally, or stay by the flags. Turns for fly and breast and some parts of the IM, basically any open turn are a crap shoot and you need to be directly over the athlete - don't get in the turn judges way though..always ask permission and introduce yourself to the referee and all of the judges.

Technically, as I mentioned, you're going to need a fast SS as everything has to be frozen solid - for that read fast lenses and a flash. The swimmer has to be recogniseable, obviously, so unless you get the face you're not getting anything - and you're shooting people in caps and goggles... so faces need to be really recogniseable.

Remember also that the only shots youre getting while swimming are going to be when theyre exerting themselves and breathing, so you'll need plenty of shots so as not to get truly ugly looking images with mouths open looking kinda gross - no one is going to buy that.

Another shot that is popular is just as the swimmer finishes and looks up at the scoreboard for their time. Their goggles are usually off and they look happy. Or they might be crying. just sayin.

What i mean by 'shoot around' is that once you're done covering johnny phelps who's dad paid 100 clams to cover his 100 breast, shoot other swimmers in the same heat. Basically you'll take a bunch of frames for every length, most of the unuseable for reasons outlined above. Be ready to keep your flash well powered so you don't miss a shot while your flash recycles.

[shiroutsuki]

Originally Posted by Jim Bryant

Here in the U.S. the only swimming event where flash is prohibited is during the diving competition.

Is that so... that's interesting! X)

[shiroutsuki]

Whew, I guess I have a lot of contacting to do! $: I just realized that I may have had an easier time getting around on deck and all because I was shooting for the club and friends.... dang! X)
Contact them as a vendor... I didn't really think of setting up a table really- just thought I'd have all of the pictures up with huge watermarks. (; ^~^)
Ooh that makes sense... behind and high of the swimmer for backstroke- no wonder mine were so LAME, seeing as I usually took them from the side. (; -__-)=3 Shooting diagonally from the corner or by the flags... that'd be really neat! \(*> W <*)/ Thing is, a majority of mine were taken hectically- running up and away from the timers whereas I've only taken pictures from either of those positions once or twice. Quite the revelation, for lack of a better word! I'll definitely be sure to ask for permission from the referee and officials now that I know I'm supposed to. Good thing they're easy to spot in their white attire! ;D
Truth is, I've never been fond of flash at all... but I guess from a further distance away, it shouldn't affect the swimmer... right...? $: Ex. swimmer comes up for breathe, take a picture and FLASH hits their eyes. /(; >___<)\
True, no one wants to purchase pictures of their kids with their mouth opened awfully... oh that's helpful! I didn't realize that that'd be a popular shot, shooting a picture when the swimmer looks at their time! X3
As I'm not a huge fan of flash, I didn't realize about flash recycle rates... whew! Time to invest in external flash much? (+ w +)"

Thanks for replying again! It's so helpful, I keep learning so much! Thanks again!