Looking to buy my first Good (to me) Camera. NEED HELP

[burners]

I currently have a Fuji V10 & Z70. They both pretty much suck.
I also have an older Nikon Coolpix (Not sure of exact model at moment) and it takes great pics in the daylight and when you have a way to stabilize the image but closeups (macro shots) and night time shots are horrible. I had to disable the blur warning because even with a stand under the camera the pictures are still blurry in dark lighting. The quality is absolute garbage indoors without tons of light. When taking pictures of our pumpkins last night it took roughly 5 full seconds from the time I pressed the shutter button until the image was actually taken, if I moved even slightly within this time the photo would be blurry.

I wanted to step up to something better and here are my needs and price range
Something for everyday shoots, family trips both indoor and outdoor
Good (average or better) battery life or cheap spare batteries so I don't have to worry half way through the day about it dying. Doesn't have to be the best just average in the range of this type of camera.
Good close up shots, I often create how-to documents for my website and sometimes review new PC parts and Microcontrollers / micro chips and would like to get some great close ups of the hardware without flash killing the photo or the blurry bug (that's a technical term) getting in the way.
HD Video Capture, I want to be able to take some short videos in 1080i or 1080p. This isnt the main focus of the unit, just a nice added feature.
Great night time shots, I want to be able to take great pictures in low light situations WITHOUT a tripod. Like in a night club (I don't go to night clubs) but a similar lighting situation with action in the background and a settings where a tri-pod doesn't make sense. This is the most important thing to me.

My budget is around $350, this means I would like to stay under $350 but if someone told me I can get X camera for $350 OR XX camera for $400 and the $400 model is the ultimate bad lad compared to the $350 model then I would go with the $400 model but it would need to be the primo compared to the lower model.

I seen in the newest Wired magazine a short shoot-out between 4 cameras and 1 was best in low light (I will have to find the article or wait till I get home).
In the mean time I found a few other cameras that fit the bill but I don't know enough about them to make a wise decision. So I am looking for some expert advice from people who have used these different higher end model of cameras and know what to look for and what to stay away from.

Panasonic DMC-FZ40K $324
Newegg.com - Panasonic DMC-FZ40K Black 14.1MP 3.0" 230K LCD 24X Optical Zoom 25mm Wide Angle Digital Camera
+ Price, 14MP, 3" LCD, SD / SDHC / SDXC Card, USB, AV, HDMI Out
- 720P video, 60 - 1/2000 sec Shutter

Nikon COOLPIX P100 $339
Newegg.com - Nikon COOLPIX P100 Black 10.3 MP 3.0" 460K Anti-reflection Coating LCD 26X Optical Zoom 26mm Wide Angle Digital Camera
+ Price, 3" LCD, Tilt & Swivel LCD (Love this feature), 5/5 Eggs
- MOV Video (nobody uses MOV), Can't find shutter speed, Can't find Movie resolution

Canon PowerShot SX20 $349
Newegg.com - Canon PowerShot SX20 IS Black 12.1 MP 2.5" 230K Vari-Angle LCD 20X Optical Zoom 28mm Wide Angle Digital Camera
+ Price, 15-1/3,200 sec. Shutter, Swing Out LCD , SD / SDHC / MMC / MMC+ / HC MMC+ Card
- 2.5" LCD, MOV video, 720P video, Looks Cheap, AA Batts (would rather have LI-ION or Li-Poly)

FUJIFILM FINEPIX HS10 $379
Newegg.com - FUJIFILM FINEPIX HS10 Black 10.0 MP 3.0" 230K Tilting LCD 30X Optical Zoom 24mm Wide Angle Digital Camera
+1080p Video, MP4 Video, 3" LCD, 1/4 sec. to 1/4000 sec Shutter Speed, Tilt & Swivel LCD (Again I Love this feature), USB, AV, HDMI Out
- Price, AA Batts, 10 MP

So there it is, I am open to other cameras as well, these are just what I found in this price range and feature set on Newegg. It looks like the Fuji is the way to go but I thought Fuji was a cheaper brand so I don't know if one of the other cameras listed above would out perform it for less cost and ultimately although the features are nice it really comes down to image quality and if it can do what I need.

Thank You for your help in advance


CHANGED TOP PICK TO CANON S95

[TheMoons678]

I dunno, I'd trade a lot of the bells and whistles of a point-and-shoot for a DSLR. I'd check ebay/craigslist for a D40, D40X, D60 with a 18-55mm lens, and possibly a 55-200mm lens all for $400 if you are patient.

Check out pictures taken with a D60:
Flickr: The Nikon D60 Club Pool

Sorry, that may not have been the answer you were looking for, but I'd recommend looking for a friend who has a DSLR and trying it out.

[burners]

I've given a lot of thought to getting a SLR / DSLR and for me the cons out weigh the pro's.
Like I said my limit is $400 TOPS and preferred to be around $350. Photography isn't my life or even a hobby of mine. So investing $400 (if I'm lucky) + just to throw more at the camera later when I find I need more lenses just doesn't make sense for me. I also plan to use this for family trips and events which means my wife will need to use it and I know the lens changing won't fly with her either.

Not to mention unless I misunderstand something I don't see any DSLR recording video which means now I have to invest even more money to buy something to record digital video so there goes another $500. So in the end I would be spending over $1k if I am lucky, and yes I would be getting better quality but I would rather spend $350 on a camera and spend the remaining $650+ on a Snowmobile, Dirt bike, some parts for my RX-7, A new Radeon 5970 and the list goes on.

[Cold]

If photography isnt even a hobby of yours, why bother even to get a camera as advanced as those you're considering?

[inkista]

Have you looked at the Canon SD4000? Or a refurbed Canon S90? Fuji and Panasonic would probably be the other two brands you want to consider for low light capability.

Personally, I think you're just dooming yourself to more low-light performance disappointment by requiring so many other features and focusing on bridge cameras with all the bells and whistles. Bridge cameras unfortunately have small sensors and slow lenses. The four you've listed all have 1/2.3" sensors, and lenses with max. apertures in the f/2.8-5.6 range. That's probably going to kill your dreams of good handheld shots in low light right there. Bridge cameras are great bang-for-the-buck cameras, but the one thing you generally have to give up is low-light capability.

The cameras that are capable of doing what you want in terms of low light are, unfortunately, the top-of-the-line P&S cameras--everybody wants low light capability. But that generally also requires larger sensors (for better high ISO performance) and a faster lens which is why dSLRs are better at this. I can highly recommend the S90, but you'd probably be disappointed in the mere 5x zoom range, no flip-out-screen and only VGA video. OTOH, you can use iso 1600. I took this shot in a not particularly brightly lit hotel convention room:


S90. @6mm (28mm equiv.), iso 1600, f/2, 1/125s. handheld. No flash. Vignette added in post.
full-size

As for dSLRs recording HD video, nearly all the new models do, now. But the used ones that are in your price range probably don't. Ditto the large-sensor compacts like the Olympus E-P1.

[burners]

Originally Posted by Cold

If photography isnt even a hobby of yours, why bother even to get a camera as advanced as those you're considering?

LOL I still want to be able to take good pictures, do you know how frustrating it is when all your pictures from a special event are grainy and blurred.

[burners]

Originally Posted by inkista

Have you looked at the Canon SD4000? Or a refurbed Canon S90? Fuji and Panasonic would probably be the other two brands you want to consider for low light capability.

Personally, I think you're just dooming yourself to more low-light performance disappointment by requiring so many other features and focusing on bridge cameras with all the bells and whistles. Bridge cameras unfortunately have small sensors and slow lenses. The four you've listed all have 1/2.3" sensors, and lenses with max. apertures in the f/2.8-5.6 range. That's probably going to kill your dreams of good handheld shots in low light right there. Bridge cameras are great bang-for-the-buck cameras, but the one thing you generally have to give up is low-light capability.

The cameras that are capable of doing what you want in terms of low light are, unfortunately, the top-of-the-line P&S cameras--everybody wants low light capability. But that generally also requires larger sensors (for better high ISO performance) and a faster lens which is why dSLRs are better at this. I can highly recommend the S90, but you'd probably be disappointed in the mere 5x zoom range, no flip-out-screen and only VGA video. OTOH, you can use iso 1600. I took this shot in a not particularly brightly lit hotel convention room:


S90. @6mm (28mm equiv.), iso 1600, f/2, 1/125s. handheld. No flash. Vignette added in post.
full-size

As for dSLRs recording HD video, nearly all the new models do, now. But the used ones that are in your price range probably don't. Ditto the large-sensor compacts like the Olympus E-P1.

I actually looked into the camera that got the good review in the Wired Magazine, it was a Canon SD4000 is but I thought why stop there? I looked at the next model up which was closer to my price limit and found the Canon SD4500 is
Newegg.com - Canon SD4500 IS Brown 10.0 MP 3.0" 230k LCD 10X Optical Zoom Digital Camera

But I wondered what was the next model up and what are the differences, then I found the Al Mighty S95
Newegg.com - Canon PowerShot S95 Black 10.0 MP 3.0" 461k LCD 3.8X Optical Zoom 28mm Wide Angle Digital Camera

This camera is damn near perfect, although it hits my budget maximum mark, Newegg had a deal yesterday where you could take 10% off any camera and I should have jumped on it while it was still in stock. Now its sold out so I have to wait or find it somewhere else.

So far this is my top pick and after watching some video taken with the camera @ 720P I am sold. The photo quality is amazing as well, but I'm sure I don't need to tell you this.

I also wanted to add I really dont care about the insane zoom of the cameras I listed, it was my un-educated-ness (just made that up) that led me to believe I needed a larger camera with a nice big lens to take better pictures. I seen the side by side of the Fuji @ ISO 1600 vs. the S95 @ ISO 1600 and it looks like you are comparing something from K-mart to a high end camera. The S95 is definitely the boss of P&S cameras.

CANON S95 - Top Pick Currently

[inkista]

Originally Posted by burners

I actually looked into the camera that got the good review in the Wired Magazine, it was a Canon SD4000 is but I thought why stop there? I looked at the next model up which was closer to my price limit and found the Canon SD4500 is
Newegg.com - Canon SD4500 IS Brown 10.0 MP 3.0" 230k LCD 10X Optical Zoom Digital Camera

But I wondered what was the next model up and what are the differences, then I found the Al Mighty S95
Newegg.com - Canon PowerShot S95 Black 10.0 MP 3.0" 461k LCD 3.8X Optical Zoom 28mm Wide Angle Digital Camera

Yes, the SD4000 and S90 are the predecessors of the SD4500 and S95. Canon tends to refresh P&S models once a year. The problem with the Ixus SD models is that they're still using the 1/2.3" sensor, while the S90/S95 is using a 1/1.7" sensor; and the SD models don't allow you full manual control over exposure settings, or let you shoot in RAW without using the CHDK.

The S95 generally retails at the $400 mark, which is why I suggested a refurbed S90 for $280 instead. If you wait a year or so, the S95 is likely to be down in the sub-$300 range, too. The S95 is definitely closer to what you want, since they added 720 HD capability to it over the S90.

... The S95 is definitely the boss of P&S cameras.

Actually, that would be the G12. Especially if you read the Strobist. It's not quite as great in low light (f/2.8 max. aperture), but it does have a better zoom range, and the flash hotshoe, as well as a flip out screen. It's actually more capable and feature-laden than the S95, but it is chunkier and some folks prefer the S95 for the portability and convenience of the smaller size. The G12 is probably more your ideal, but as it retails closer to $500, at that point, you're probably better off looking for an entry-level dSLR or a micro four-thirds camera.

The S95 and G12 share the same sensor and processor, so the image quality and iso performance from both of them is pretty equivalent.

[Photologyst]

Originally Posted by burners

LOL I still want to be able to take good pictures, do you know how frustrating it is when all your pictures from a special event are grainy and blurred.

No, I don’t because it typically doesn’t happen; certainly not with all photos of such an event. With digital you can see what you are doing and improve the next photo.

Even if you have a decent point and shoot and know how to use it properly, your photos will not be grainy and blurry.

Expensive, high-end equipment does not always a good photographer make.

[RichardTaylor]

I disagree with the some of the preceding statement by Photologyst

In poor available light where you are shooting at ISO 800 or higher with a P&S camera the pictures will be very grainy. Yes it can be controlled - up to a point, when PPing at the cost of detail loss.

For some subject it may not matter however if there are peoples faces it does to me.
Shooting at a slower shutter speed, even with image stabilisation, doesn't always help if there is subject movement.
Keep in mind you may also be shooting wide open where lens IQ may not be the best.

Here are two examples taken at a classical music concert where I was asked, without warning, to shoot the concert by the choirs webmaster.

(1) Canon G11 (pic has been PP'd from the original RAW)

Camera Canon PowerShot G11
Exposure 0.05 sec (1/20)
Aperture f/3.5
Focal Length 15.7 mm
ISO Speed 800
Exposure Bias -1/3 EV
Flash Off, Did not fire

(2) Canon 5D with Canon 24-105 F4 IS L lens.
Pic has been PP'd from the original RAW


Camera Canon EOS 5D + Canon 24-105 F4 IS L lens
Exposure 0.05 sec (1/20)
Aperture f/5.6
Focal Length 105 mm
ISO Speed 1600
Exposure Bias 0 EV
Flash Off, Did not fire

Even though I wasn't real happy with the G11 pics the choir members were.

For subsequent concerts, and nowdays, I didn't bother taking the G11, just a couple of DSLR's with fast primes Works a lot better

Quote
"Expensive, high-end equipment does not always a good photographer make."
End quote.
Yes, However it does make capturing technically ok images a lot easier, or even possible, especially when shooting in difficult conditions.