I'm starting to think I may have a problem here...

[MrJones]

Hi all,
for some time I get really poor results as far as noise and sharpness is concerned with my 40D.
I always felt that it might be a technique problem so I kept going and tried to improve myself till I just compared a friend's 50D to my 40D and the difference was like light years away (guessing it shouldn't be that big a difference in image quality).
basically my camera creates noise like a poor point and shoot
what do you think? I've compared it to one taken at ISO 1250 with the 50D (approximately the same location) and the 50D handled it much much better at twice the ISO.
is it the model or my specific camera? any ideas?

here is a sample from my 40D taken at 24mm with the 24-105 f/4 IS USM @ f/4.
SB 580EX II fired.
shutter speed was 1/100 and the ISO was 640 (shouldn't result in THAT much noise).
this is at 100%, SOC, RAW file.

[RichardTaylor]

Most, if not all, of the picture is unexposed. The white table cloths are not really white and the background is really under exposed.
That will make noise look particularly bad.

How do correctly exposed pics look?

[Thunder_o_b]

Has this problem been there since you got the camera? Do you have the latest firmware for it? Canon U.S.A. : Support & Drivers : EOS 40D

I have the 50D and my wife has the 40D and the 40D is better as far as noise is concerned. But not by a tremendous amount. It is strange to hear of a 40D with noise issues.

[Thunder_o_b]

Yeah, Richard makes a very good point about under exposure. Big noise maker.

[MrJones]

ok, I read your comments and since I have both cameras at my place right now, I've started to make some tests.
funny thing, the 40D photos come out a bit brighter than the 50D with the same settings. kinda weird.
anyway, the 50D handles noise better but still results in significant noise at ISO 1600.
any suggestions on how to resolve this issue?
I'm starting to photograph small events, and most of them take place in places with bad lightning.
I use the 580EX II but I need the ISO for the background to be visible and not dark.
I photographed this kind of event today, here is another sample that was shot at ISO 1000 at 1/125 with flash.
this is a shot of the tables but you can see the noise on the chairs and background (this is at 50%).
can't get below 1/125 since then I get motion blurs with people (would love to bump it up to 1/250).
any suggestions?

[inkista]

Are you doing any noise reduction in post-processing (NeatImage, NoiseNinja, etc.)? Are you shooting RAW or JPEG? And what noise-reduction settings are you using in-camera? Are you using 1/3EV ISO settings? And have you tried digital pull-processing?

[MrJones]

Hi inkista,
I'm not using any noise reduction at the moment and mostly I shoot JPEG (taking almost 1000 photos in RAW can be a pain...)
about in-camera... what do you mean exactly? I'm not aware of any noise-reduction process that can be used in-camera.
and the 1/3 EV ISO chart in very enlightening! will keep that in mind!
btw, I've heard full frame cameras handle noise much much better than cropped sensors, is that one solution to keep in mind? is the difference significant?

[Thunder_o_b]

You really need to post process your shots,and use some kind of NR program. The nature of what digital files are makes post prose necessary. Even with the best digital cameras, some of it is needed.

The flash you have is well up to the task (I have this flash and it is tremendous) Set the flash to over expose what the ETTL calls for. This flash is adjustable over a six stop range in 1/3 increments. Are you diffusing the flash? Or bouncing it off the ceiling? Hopefully you are not diffusing while bouncing.

[MrJones]

Hi Thunder,
I'm not bouncing and diffusing.. lol.. just bouncing.
do you have a good NR plugin for photoshop you can recommend?
I've browsed the web for the last hour, checking out the ISO performance of the 5D MK II and it really makes a difference.
I'll be needing a second camera soon anyway.. so maybe that could be a nice solution? shooting with the 5D as the main camera and have the 40D as secondary?
god! why does this thing have to be so expansive???

btw, overexposing the flash still doesn't solve the problem, cause the problem is with the background which demands high ISO. that is, unless I'm missing something..

[RichardTaylor]

Re noise reduction on the 40D.

See page 56 of the (English) instruction manual.

I shoot with a 40D and 5D. A gut feeling there is about one stop improvement with the 5D.

I always shoot RAW and use , sometimes selective, noise reduction when shooting at high ISO (800 up).

The other possible alternative is to shoot with a fast lens.