Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Senior Portraits PRICING - help

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    I think part of it is, you are right, there are only a few people who regularly contribute which is good because I mean, if not them then who? But at the same time, I think it does come across as a bit negative. I don't believe in being blunt, if it means hurting someones feelings (awww). You can be honest without being rude. But alas, this is the internet and being honest IS being rude because, we are not face to face with the person anyway, who cares?

    For me, my qualm with the "grumpy pros" is that we newbies can't win. You claim we should NEVER EVER WORK FOR FREE!!! Ok, advice taken...so then when he say, "Ok we are just starting out, how much should we charge??" TO which the reply is often, DONT START CHARGING UNTIL YOU HAVE MORE EXPERIENCE!

    So which is it? Can't have both. I think thats where the "grumpy pro" persona comes in. You have a problem if we do column a or column b. Make sense? My observations based merely on a month or so being on here

    To the OP - if they ask you to work for them, then you are "good enough for them". Let them know you are new, hence a cheaper discounted rate. I would go low because this is for experience, not money to retire with...maybe $50 each person.

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by fofazoju View Post
      I think part of it is, you are right, there are only a few people who regularly contribute which is good because I mean, if not them then who? But at the same time, I think it does come across as a bit negative. I don't believe in being blunt, if it means hurting someones feelings (awww). You can be honest without being rude. But alas, this is the internet and being honest IS being rude because, we are not face to face with the person anyway, who cares?

      For me, my qualm with the "grumpy pros" is that we newbies can't win. You claim we should NEVER EVER WORK FOR FREE!!! Ok, advice taken...so then when he say, "Ok we are just starting out, how much should we charge??" TO which the reply is often, DONT START CHARGING UNTIL YOU HAVE MORE EXPERIENCE!

      So which is it? Can't have both. I think thats where the "grumpy pro" persona comes in. You have a problem if we do column a or column b. Make sense? My observations based merely on a month or so being on here

      To the OP - if they ask you to work for them, then you are "good enough for them". Let them know you are new, hence a cheaper discounted rate. I would go low because this is for experience, not money to retire with...maybe $50 each person.
      Thank you!!!! This is exactly what I am trying to say! Who wants to come to a "SCHOOL" and be slapped in the face every time they ask a question regarding money?

      I've seen a lot of help given and and have also received a lot of help regarding composition, colors, etc but when the word money is mentioned it's an immediate slap in the face until you are an award winning excellent top notch photographer.

      ----- I too get frustrated and even have to laugh a bit when I see a post of "got my camera and tomorrow Im shooting a wedding"... I get it, I DJ'ed weddings for 6 years... I saw a lot of fly by night DJ services that thought they could slap on a CD and let it roll for a few hours and collect the money and run. I get it. I just wish there was a better way to tell someone then to be rude about it. You're right, its the fact that we're not sitting face to face and we can say whatever we want to through our computers.
      Roy

      My Flickr

      Comment


      • #18
        @Royey, agreed, forums are a wonderful opportunity. I appreciate you taking my comments in the spirit they were truly meant. After two weeks of excessive posting on political blogs regarding the situation in Wisconsin, I apologise if some of that spilled over into my reply!

        @Fuzzy, the mutual love affair continues!

        @fofazoju, In one way I agree with you. The culture I live in right now in the US, it's regarded as a virtue to "tell it like it is", and when I grew up in the UK, and maybe it was just my family, this was anathema, and rude. Some people feel they have a right to impose their opinions on others as though they're facts.

        However there is a time and a place for it. Starting a business is serious... business. You're dealing with real money, yours and someone else's, and also facing legal issues, contractual issues and tax issues. That's why the gloves come off, because there are real implications.

        Often times, they come from a place where they're patted on the back by friends and family with next to no idea of what they're actually inciting. As anyone will tell you, a photography business isn't about photography, that's only a small element.

        When you consult with professionals, you expect to get it straight from the horse's mouth so to speak. If I go speak to an accountant, I want the facts. At some point, you're going to hear something that is contrary to the preconceptions you had, and it's not going to feel good.

        Ultimately the stark reality is painful to hear (which is probably why so few posters of these questions do not persevere with their inquiry). Really before you ask the question "when should I charge", you should have done your own homework. To consider charging and starting a business before you have taken the time to read about it, well, it's asanine.

        Sometimes that smack in the face of a harsh comment is what you need to really question, deep down, just where you are as opposed to where you think you are. If you can face criticism and justify yourself to it, it builds confidence.

        I don't think you'll find a single Pro who has never worked for free. You simply have to understand why you're doing it, and make sure it's a good deal for you. There needs to be an outcome that you need, whether its a tangible result or not.

        There are ways to gain experience without going out on a limb, such as working alongside an established photographer. All of your technique can be practiced on family and friends, in order that when you do 'unpaid' portfolio building, you're already at a technical level that will yield positive results...

        ...however, its unethical to 'practice' on clients (whether they're paying or not).

        It's not a black and white situation. There are many ways to go about it to ensure that you maintain the integrity of your work and protect it's reputation.
        Website ... Blog ... Facebook

        Comment


        • #19
          You claim we should NEVER EVER WORK FOR FREE!!! Ok, advice taken...so then when he say, "Ok we are just starting out, how much should we charge??" TO which the reply is often, DONT START CHARGING UNTIL YOU HAVE MORE EXPERIENCE!
          Not quite. The only time I personally feel it is okay to work for free is for a personal project or to support a cause which you would support anyway.

          Just an example; before I started charging for pet portraits, I shot thousands of portraits of homeless animals in shelters and rescue situations. I owe my ability to get something out of any dog of any temperament to all those rescue "models" that I practiced on and still work with from time to time.

          I don't say "don't start charging until you have more experience," I say, "if your work is good enough to sell, sell it for the going rate." Base your pricing on what your work is worth rather than on how long you've been producing it. I also say, "if your work isn't worth charging the going rate, don't charge until it is."

          I try not to be a total a$$ and come out with "You Suck!" That said, if you clearly aren't ready, I'll tell you so. Gruff, rude, whatever? Maybe, but it's at least honest.
          Best,
          Jim
          Facebook
          Visit my website

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by BigFuzzy View Post
            Best advice I've ever gotten in life, whether it be in my personal, professional, or photographic life, has been the most honestly blunt... sugar coating people is what gets them to show up on shows like American Idol to be laughed at because their fam and friends were nice to them instead of.. honest?
            Big Fuzzy this is why I asked you about that barn I was working on the other day! I kinda had a feeling after being here a few months that you would tell me straight up how bad it sucked...lol....and I'm thankful for the brutal honesty!

            I think everyone needs to remember that if you post here looking for help or advise you will receive all sorts of opinions, some of which may not make your day. Having all the problems pointed out with the "barn" even after several hours of messing around with it "did not make my day" BUT as a result I now have an image I am proud of. You need to take what is offered and learn from it. Then make your own decisions as to how to proceed from there.
            Website
            Facebook

            Comment


            • #21
              I've read everything between the op and the last post and I have this question...where is the original poster? And I agree, if she doesn't know the basics then there should be no charge. When I was building a portfolio I charged little to nothing. Of course they were close personal friends who have since paid for my services. There are few reasons to do it for free but there is no reason to charge when you shouldn't. I hope that made sense.
              I'm a Nikkon kinda gal.
              http://mygirlphotography.com

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Tara333 View Post
                I've read everything between the op and the last post and I have this question...where is the original poster? And I agree, if she doesn't know the basics then there should be no charge. When I was building a portfolio I charged little to nothing. Of course they were close personal friends who have since paid for my services. There are few reasons to do it for free but there is no reason to charge when you shouldn't. I hope that made sense.
                Agreed!, and yes, I happened upon this today, read everything and wondered the same about the original poster? But I think someone even mentioned that's part of the problem, people spend time trying to answer questions or give advise and the original person never shows up again!
                Website
                Facebook

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by mshockley View Post
                  Agreed!, and yes, I happened upon this today, read everything and wondered the same about the original poster? But I think someone even mentioned that's part of the problem, people spend time trying to answer questions or give advise and the original person never shows up again!
                  True and it's a shame but there are a lot of people who will read these threads/posts and learn from them. So don't think that just because the original poster has flown the coup that you've wasted your time. From those of us that take onboard the good advice, read the debates and learn a little something each time thanks for taking the time whether your a Pro or amature.
                  We all come into this world naked, screaming violently and covered in blood. If things are done right, we go out the same way.

                  http://shortfatblokerunning.blogspot.com/

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    +1 to that. I've read through heaps of threads where the OP never returned. But I learned an awful lot along the way. Keep it up.
                    Lisa
                    Nikon D90, Nikkor 18-200mm 3.5-5.6, NIKKOR 50mm f/1.8D
                    My Flickr, Panoramio, Click Fifty-Two - A BLog,
                    "There's far more good people in the world than there are bad." - Kylie Phaup-Stephens

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by AnonymousKiwi1 View Post
                      +1 to that. I've read through heaps of threads where the OP never returned. But I learned an awful lot along the way. Keep it up.
                      Not to mention the OP is 17 years old....lol....could be off doing anything about now! But I sure do agree with you. I don't usually say too much around here, but I have read so many threads and learned so much. The information so freely shared here is priceless to me
                      Website
                      Facebook

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Wow, what jerks....(Jim Poor and Niresangwa). I have no business charging?? wow.
                        To all of you wondering "where's the OP, where's the OP???!!?!?!" Well, I'm here and I've read everything. I don't just "LEAVE" when I post a question.
                        You know, I don't remember all your usernames and whatnot, but a lot of you were very rude. I just asked a simple question. I didn't know what a good price was to charge for the portraits and I was just seeking a simple answer. Maybe a kind person explaining that $100 is a good deal for someone wanting senior portraits or maybe that it was too much...or maybe something HELPFUL. I do the best with portraits...I just don't know what to do about pricing. I've sold photos in stores before...so I'm not just some young 17 year old with no experience. And whoever you were that wrote that long post about pros and how you get tired of answering the same questions over and over...then don't answer the question! Take your attitude somewhere else. I'd rather my question not get answered than for it to get answered rudely. And just because back in "November" I had a few questions wondering about external flashes means I have 0 experience??? I'm just trying to learn here! Wow.

                        But I'd like to thank those that did answer with a kind post and a simple answers/thought. Like, royey123 and fofazoju

                        This might be the last time I ask a question here. Do you pros really think you're above everyone else??? How do you think you got to your position anyway? You were at the beginner stage once........geez

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          So, now you claim experience that you earlier clearly didn't claim when you said you have no clue? Sorry, I don't buy it. I'm more than happy to be wrong, and if so - good luck with it.
                          Best,
                          Jim
                          Facebook
                          Visit my website

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Dennismc View Post
                            If these are friends of yours, or close to it, do it as TFP. You dont charge them, but get the experience and the photos for your own portfolio and they get prints and or copies for themselves.

                            Its a win/win that way.
                            Let them know before hand you are just starting out and learning, That way the expectations are not very high, they can still have them done by a local pro and pay for them, but this way you also get some experience out of it.

                            jmo.
                            This is very good advice. I got my start taking travel photos on my trips on vacations and learning from them. My neighbors began asking me to take pictures of birthdays, family generation portraits and other occasions. I was asked to take portraits for Cancer Survivor groups and Home Economics groups for their 75th aniversary meeting. I am featured in that groups History Album. Also been asked to use my pictures on shirts etc. by a local entertainer and am featured in a Hospital's new addition with many professional people. I am not a professional but very honored for the oportunity to learn by practice. I just love a hobby of photography with all it has to offer. Helping others with their needs for free is giving me a great education and new friends.
                            [http://community.webshots.com/user/FranksPhotography

                            http://www.amazon.com/Crime-Photogra.../dp/0123757282

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by madisonlaird View Post
                              Wow, what jerks....(Jim Poor and Niresangwa). I have no business charging?? wow.
                              To all of you wondering "where's the OP, where's the OP???!!?!?!" Well, I'm here and I've read everything. I don't just "LEAVE" when I post a question.
                              You know, I don't remember all your usernames and whatnot, but a lot of you were very rude. I just asked a simple question. I didn't know what a good price was to charge for the portraits and I was just seeking a simple answer. Maybe a kind person explaining that $100 is a good deal for someone wanting senior portraits or maybe that it was too much...or maybe something HELPFUL. I do the best with portraits...I just don't know what to do about pricing. I've sold photos in stores before...so I'm not just some young 17 year old with no experience. And whoever you were that wrote that long post about pros and how you get tired of answering the same questions over and over...then don't answer the question! Take your attitude somewhere else. I'd rather my question not get answered than for it to get answered rudely. And just because back in "November" I had a few questions wondering about external flashes means I have 0 experience??? I'm just trying to learn here! Wow.

                              But I'd like to thank those that did answer with a kind post and a simple answers/thought. Like, royey123 and fofazoju

                              This might be the last time I ask a question here. Do you pros really think you're above everyone else??? How do you think you got to your position anyway? You were at the beginner stage once........geez
                              Apologies to you, I had a feeling maybe you were reading the posts.

                              You have some wonderful shots on your flickr stream, and if I were you I would consider taking Big Fuzzy's advise and see if you can work a few sessions with a photographer in your area. You could also simply ask some local studio's what they charge for a senior session? Get a starting point and base your price on that.

                              As I said in my first post, I think what you need to do is take everything you read here and learn from it, then make your own decisions. This was the main thing I wanted to tell you by posting to your thread.

                              Also, what I said about you being 17 was not a dig, so much as what I would consider an explanation as to why you might not have been around to post.As I have kids your age, I figured maybe you off doing something fun! Try and look at it from the point of someone who takes the time to respond to a question and then the OP never returns. It happens all the time. Or like you, they are reading but not responding. At least you did in fact respond to all you've read.

                              As for people having to answer the same questions over and over again, I wouldn't worry too much about that. I have read this complaint before here. If you have made an honest attempt and done a search through the site and cannot find a thread that helps you with your question, just ask it. If it's a repeat so be it. The general feeling around here is that the people who take the time to respond truly do want to help you.

                              Good Luck with your Photography!
                              Website
                              Facebook

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by madisonlaird View Post
                                Wow, what jerks....(Jim Poor and Niresangwa). I have no business charging?? wow.
                                To all of you wondering "where's the OP, where's the OP???!!?!?!" Well, I'm here and I've read everything. I don't just "LEAVE" when I post a question.
                                You know, I don't remember all your usernames and whatnot, but a lot of you were very rude. I just asked a simple question. I didn't know what a good price was to charge for the portraits and I was just seeking a simple answer. Maybe a kind person explaining that $100 is a good deal for someone wanting senior portraits or maybe that it was too much...or maybe something HELPFUL. I do the best with portraits...I just don't know what to do about pricing. I've sold photos in stores before...so I'm not just some young 17 year old with no experience. And whoever you were that wrote that long post about pros and how you get tired of answering the same questions over and over...then don't answer the question! Take your attitude somewhere else. I'd rather my question not get answered than for it to get answered rudely. And just because back in "November" I had a few questions wondering about external flashes means I have 0 experience??? I'm just trying to learn here! Wow.

                                But I'd like to thank those that did answer with a kind post and a simple answers/thought. Like, royey123 and fofazoju

                                This might be the last time I ask a question here. Do you pros really think you're above everyone else??? How do you think you got to your position anyway? You were at the beginner stage once........geez
                                Exhibit A.

                                Over sensitive and still missing the point.

                                Did you even bother to search the forums for the answer to your question (heck on this subforum, all you have to do is scroll down the page, usually)?

                                Have you bothered to look around in your locality to see what others charge?

                                If you had done either or both you would have had a great place to start, and no reason to ask such a basic question.

                                As for how I got into my position, I followed the advice of the gruff arrogant pro's on this forum without pitching a fit.
                                Website ... Blog ... Facebook

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X