First DSLR - Canon EOS 350D vs Nikon D40

[TheWolf]

I am sure this has been done to death :) But any suggestions would be mega-appreciated :p

[mattdm]

What's your background in photography and what are you looking to do? (Where do you want to go from here?)

[TheWolf]

Hi matt - I am a beginner. I dont know where I want to go. Ofcourse ideally, I want to get better at shooting, and perhaps oneday become a freelance photographer. Shooting landscapes gives me bigger appeal than closeups. I have heard bad things about the d40 as with the autofocus not working on all lenses. Is this the same for the Canon?

[Taallyn]

Either one is a good camera and both have the capability of helping you take great photographs. Go to a store and see which one feels better in your hands. You will use a less-featured camera that feels comfortable to you more than you will use one with more options that doesn't feel comfortable for you.

Edit: The D40 autofocuses with lens that have built-in focus motors. All of Nikon's consumer lenses have internal motors. It is only when you start to get into pro level primes and zooms that you have to worry about it. In other words, it really isn't as big of a problem as people make it seem to be.

[wulf]

Generally people will recommend what they own. I can certainly say that the D40 has been an excellent choice for me.

The main thing to remember is that, even with the entry level cameras you are looking at, you are chosing a whole system. One of the reasons the D40 works well for me is that I don't mind manually focussing and am not hooked on in-camera metering, which means there is a wide range of cheap old lenses that let me explore different viewpoints without spending too much at a time. That may or may not fit you.

Have you got any friends or family with DSLRs? If so, that might provide both an opportunity for some hands on experience and also an idea of who you might be able to borrow gear from! ;)

Wulf

[mattdm]

Canon doesn't have the issue with internal lens motors because they went through this same issue in 1987 -- now all of their lenses have internal motors so there's no problem. Nikon is just starting to make this shift, and they're doing it at the low end first for whatever reason.

Going with what Wulf said about people recommending what they own, I highly suggest you also include Pentax in your consideration. If you're really serious about photography, the Pentax K10D gives you a semi-pro level camera for about the price of the Canon Rebel XTI or the Nikon D40x -- dual-wheel control and a weathersealed body. Or, the K100D Super will save you enough money that you can spend more on lenses.

Which brings me to the best way to make this decision: take stock of what you think you'll want in terms of lens ranges, and then look at what the various systems offer and in what price ranges. That's how I ended up choosing Pentax. :)

[inkista]

A Nikon shooter on opensourcephoto (http://www.opensourcephoto.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=23415) put together the following spreadsheet (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=p5awxzwczPGjeyHdUkpVBDQ) comparing the price spread between Canon and Nikon lenses, using prices on Adorama. It makes interesting reading.

[the_camera_poser]

I have a 350D, and I find it's build to be a bit too plasticky and the AF to be fairly innaccurate. Don't get me wrong, it takes cgood pictures, but it's well and truly yesterday's technology. I'd go for a 30D if I were you- it's head and shoulders above the 350D. Or, igf you want to really save some cash, go for a 20D in good condition. There are plenty of them out there, and they are still a very good camera.

As per nikon vs canon- well..... (putting on flamesuit)...... just have a stroll through any number of websites that cater to all body users, and see if polls have been posted about what bodies people use. Canon's pretty popular.... :)

[the_camera_poser]

A Nikon shooter on opensourcephoto (http://www.opensourcephoto.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=23415) put together the following spreadsheet (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=p5awxzwczPGjeyHdUkpVBDQ) comparing the price spread between Canon and Nikon lenses, using prices on Adorama. It makes interesting reading.

Holy smokes- those Noink lenses are dear! I'm not going to complain about the 17-55/2.8 IS ever again!

[kirbinster]

Its hard to say till you use both, perhaps there are some comparisons at www.kenrockwell.com (http://www.kenrockwell.com) .

I have a D40 and a D80, and think the D40 is a great entry camera. What is really nice about it is the compact size, light weight and feel in your hand. While it lacks some of the advanced features of cameras like the D80 on up to the D300 it is still a very good camera and I still use it quite a bit.

I don't think you will find any (well maybe many) bad cameras from the major brand names, so it is more do you like brand "A" versus brand "B". I think Nikon has better optics, but that is just my opinion, and I am sure Cannon owners feel differently.

[mattdm]

Its hard to say till you use both, perhaps there are some comparisons at www.kenrockwell.com (http://www.kenrockwell.com) .


Err, yeah, but probably not very thoughtful ones. Read the "about page" on his site (not linking to it because I don't really want to increase the google ranking).

Some choice quotes: "I started this site as a joke in 1999 after I took a community college class in webmaking as a place I could share each weekend's photos with my friends." and "While occasionally inspired by actual products or experiences, this site is entirely a work of fiction. It's a joke! Any resemblance to any actual people, places, products or anything is purely coincidental. This site is private and provided only for the entertainment of my personal friends and myself."

[mattdm]

A Nikon shooter on opensourcephoto (http://www.opensourcephoto.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=23415) put together the following spreadsheet (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=p5awxzwczPGjeyHdUkpVBDQ) comparing the price spread between Canon and Nikon lenses, using prices on Adorama. It makes interesting reading.

It'd be interesting to add in Pentax and Olympus. (Pentax: a few really awesome primes, lots of relatively cheap old glass although it's getting scarce, weak on long zooms. Olympus: great glass for astoundingly high prices, almost no third-party.)

[kirbinster]

Don't know about the initial history about ken rockwell, but he has some very good information and knows his stuff. Sure he has strong opinion, but he admits they are opinions. I have found some of his insights invaluable.

[mattdm]

Don't know about the initial history about ken rockwell, but he has some very good information and knows his stuff. Sure he has strong opinion, but he admits they are opinions. I have found some of his insights invaluable.

Basically he just spouts off whatever comes to mind without thinking about it much. He's a good photographer so sometimes that's interesting, but he's also prone to saying some really whacked-out stuff. Often, he seems to do that on purpose just to get people all upset and drive traffic to his site -- trolling for ad dollars, basically.

[brambo76]

I think it's a bit unfair comparison.. it's either old or mistaken in some cases.
Canon does has a pricey 135mm 2.0 lens ~$900. I found that Nikon lens were a bit more expensive and harder to find, but not that much different from Canon.

[inkista]

From Adorama, today:

Canon EF 135mm f/2L USM (US): $899.95
Nikon 135mm f/2.0D AF DC Nikkor (US): $1064.95

Still looks $150 cheaper to me. :-)

I don't think it's unfair. These prices and lenses were included in the original spreadsheet, and it's also true that Nikon doesn't offer a $280 135mm f/2.8 option as Canon does, any more than Canon makes an 18-200 zoom.

[mattdm]

From Adorama, today:

Canon EF 135mm f/2L USM (US): $899.95
Nikon 135mm f/2.0D AF DC Nikkor (US): $1064.95

Still looks $150 cheaper to me. :-)


Also worth noting that Nikon has a 5-year warranty instead of Canon's 1.

[Usuqa]

if its any help i was also looking for my first dslr and i decided on a pentax k10d but found a samsung gx10 secondhand for £360 with both kit len's.

Why did i pick pentax? For the price the k10d/gx10 is so much more camera than what nikon or canon will give you for similar cash. I wanted a camera that i could learn from and that i wouldn't out grow any time soon and from alot of the reading i did it just made sense.

Im still leaning how to use it, i can Imagen it will take me a while before i am able to do exactly what i want from it without fiddling hehe.. but its the same with anything new (if only had it since friday).

The main thing to think about really is that you will be buying into a system. Camera body's will come and go (because of upgrades in sensors and other things) but the lens you collect over the years will more than likely keep you shotting the same system/brand.

*edit* heres (http://digital-photography-school.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12115) the post i made about me getting the cam, has a few of my first pictures taken with it.

[airbrushjohn]

hi everyone, this is an interesting thread. to me brand names don't really mean much. here is why, when i was at the position of what my first dslr would be, i researched every camera i could find, at the time the olympus
e-500 2 lens kit was the best bang for the buck in the price range i was looking at. well i didn't know what i wanted to shoot, but as time went on i shot alot of sports, so i researched the next lens, so i bought the 50-200mm
2.8-3.5 it is a great lens, but i don't understand why oly didn't make it a 2.8 only! the noise was the problem in low light, yes i have noise ninja, but sometimes it wouldn't clean up. anyway, at work we use canon 10d, 20d, and 30d. my boss has a 70-200mm 2.8 non is lens. well i did a side by side shooting comparison (night time high school football game), and the canon in my opinion was the sharper and way less noise. both cameras were set the same aperture mode, iso 1600, custom white balance. now like i said i'm not a brand person, i can set our 10d on iso 3200 and it is so much more useable, and cleans up great in noise ninja. and i have tested the 40d at iso 3200 it is really what i'm looking for. now i have only used my friend's nikon d50, and it takes some awesome photos, but he doesn't have and won't buy a 2.8 lens. so i can't compare. but i could have went either way, but since we use canon at work, thats why i went with canon, i bought a 70-200 2.8 lens, and i use the cameras from work. and yes i do have my boss's permission. sorry about being long, john

[mattdm]

hi everyone, this is an interesting thread. to me brand names don't really mean much. here is why, [...]


I don't understand — you say the brands don't mean much, but then talk about big differences between the system....


shoot, but as time went on i shot alot of sports, so i researched the next lens, so i bought the 50-200mm
2.8-3.5 it is a great lens, but i don't understand why oly didn't make it a 2.8 only! the noise was the problem in low


Because it's already a $1200 lens? How much more do you want it to cost? :)

[Major_Small]

I think airbrushjohn was just trying to say that he doesn't make decisions based on the brand name. There are, however big differences between the brands, and I think airbrushjohn probably didn't realize that Canon and Nikon are at the top of the line not because of corporate politics, but because they really and truly are the best of the best.

[vandergus]

In case anyone is looking for a purchase in the near future, there have been some great deals for the D40 on various websites (yes, reputible websites like amazon and B&H Photo). They usually involve an instant rebate and you end up with a D40 with 18-55mm and 55-200mm for ~$575. That's one heck of a starter kit for a DSLR.

[kirbinster]

Most of those deals include the old 55-200 which is non-VR!

There are a lot of good deals on lightly used D40's out there. Here is one that just sold on Nikonian.com:

"Nikon D40 w/18-55mm in 'as new' condition with less than 200 shutter actuations.
Includes original box & all contents plus 52mm Nikon NC filter and Sandisk 2GB SD card.
$340 includes insured shipping to ConUSA"

[vandergus]

Most of those deals include the old 55-200 which is non-VR!

Good point. If I were to get that lense I would probably want VR.